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10:58 | hobana.freenode.net | [freenode-info] please register your nickname...don't forget to auto-identify! http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#nicksetup |
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13:14 | tch__ | bashintosh, bernie ping |
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16:42 | bernie | tch__: very busy now. what's up? |
16:42 | tch__ | bernie, np, we meet at 22:00 UTC? |
16:43 | bernie | tch__: yup ok. i have to leave in about 30 minutes though |
16:43 | i need to setup the video room for the weekly anime night at the office | |
16:44 | tch__ | bernie, deme, can you come 30mins earlier then :)? |
16:45 | bernie, btw, do you know who controls ASLO mirrors for activities download? | |
16:54 | bernie | tch__: several admins |
16:54 | tch__: check the mirrors page in the wiki | |
16:54 | tch__: all sysadmin docs are in the same place | |
16:55 | tch__: ok i'll come 30 mins earlier | |
16:55 | tch__ | bernie, arigato! |
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21:55 | tch__ | hello cjl ! |
21:56 | cjl | Hi tch__ |
21:57 | So the new Pootle features seem to take care of Pootle->git push, but do they update POT? | |
21:57 | The git_>Pootle bit | |
21:58 | We use pootlehelper script potupdater to do that now. | |
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22:02 | tch__ | cjl, I tested pootle->git integration in my local (fresh) instances, but I can't find it in the migrated one |
22:02 | bashintosh | Hello world! |
22:02 | tch__ | cjl, regarding pot files, I am looking for that, |
22:02 | cjl | hallo |
22:03 | ok tch__ | |
22:03 | tch__ | cjl, did you get the chance to test the migrated instance? (newpootle.sugarlabs.org) |
22:03 | bashintosh, welcome! | |
22:03 | bashintosh | reads the log |
22:04 | cjl | tch__: Not really |
22:05 | bernie | tch__: do we start now? |
22:05 | tch__ | bashintosh, bernie cjl yes please |
22:05 | bernie | #startmeeting |
22:05 | meeting | Meeting started Wed Aug 6 22:05:39 2014 UTC. The chair is bernie. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. |
22:05 | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #endmeeting | |
22:06 | tch__ | ok, |
22:06 | since the last meeting, we upgraded the VM to newer ubuntu, we revived the 2.5 instance and we migrated it to 2.5.1 | |
22:07 | the problem now, even after reading the translation wiki sections, I lack of context to determine if the instance is working sucessfully | |
22:07 | s/successfully/properly | |
22:07 | cjl | I can enter words |
22:08 | tch__ | also, I am a bit confused by some diferences between the fresh 2.5.1 instance I set at home, and this migrated one |
22:08 | cjl | honey2 / cookiesearch.po completed, I don't see commit button though |
22:08 | tch__ | ie,. I should be seeing VCS options in the project, but I dont |
22:08 | cjl, exactly, | |
22:09 | cjl | Did yiu import from old pootle backups in your fresh instance? |
22:09 | tch__ | cjl, no, I added it as a new project following the procedure in pootle 2.5.1 docs |
22:10 | cjl, that means without the custom scripts, but I see now that the custom SL scripts does a lot of things, | |
22:11 | cjl, I am a bit worried about my lack of information about the use cases for the instance, | |
22:12 | cjl | How can I help explain use cases? |
22:13 | Coder writes activity, generates POT once, never touches the git /po directory again (under old Pootle workflow). The scripts did the rest. | |
22:14 | tch__ | i see, |
22:14 | cjl | Translator works on words, submits strings, lang admin does commit to VCS |
22:15 | potupdater script synched the pootle-local git repo with git and generated new POT nightly (if needed) | |
22:16 | As Pootle admin, I would do "Update from Templates to roll out new POT to all langs. | |
22:17 | tch__ | can you write down these steps and specify which tools you used for each? |
22:17 | cjl | yes |
22:17 | bernie | cool |
22:17 | tch__ | is a bit confusing to tell what was done before through pootle itself and custom |
22:18 | bernie | btw, since we're redoing a few things... wouldn't it make more sense if pootle did *not* write into all git repos like this? |
22:18 | cjl | Yes, the added VCS stuff in Poolte is confusing |
22:18 | bernie | if i was the maintainer of an activity, i'd want to *pull* from the pootle git repositories into mine. |
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22:18 | cjl | bernie, idea is for lang admin to have control of push |
22:18 | bernie | and i'd do it just before a release, for example. |
22:19 | cjl | but I am not adverse to change |
22:19 | averse | |
22:19 | bernie | cjl: but the language admins can't release a new version of the activity bundle, can they? |
22:19 | cjl | no |
22:20 | tch__ | bernie, I actually research a bit about that, looking if it was possible for pootle to do PR in github, but I found nothing |
22:20 | cjl | I would run through and do a lot for lang admins |
22:20 | bernie | cjl: oh maybe they can make a custom bundle and put it on their deployment activity collection, for example |
22:20 | tch__: yeah it would be great that way | |
22:21 | cjl | do you eman like our lang_packs? |
22:21 | bernie | tch__: changing topic: did you get a chance to extract the last state from the backups? |
22:21 | cjl: is it important to recover the list of projects, users and ACLs from the backup? | |
22:22 | cjl | yes |
22:22 | bernie | tch__: if you could upgrade pootle and preserve the data, then it should be easy to do it again |
22:22 | tch__ | bernie, not really, I focused on making it "work... to many things at once is too hard to handle |
22:22 | cjl | Trying a recovery into your instance would be a great next step |
22:22 | tch__ | bernie, that is what I did, |
22:22 | bernie | tch__: the backup should have a directory with a dump of the mysql db... at least, all machines i setup do daily mysql dumps in their /backup dirs. |
22:23 | tch__ | I mean, I used the db that was left in newpootle |
22:23 | working in that machine is a bit hard though, too many db copies running, different users owning different things, looks like it all attached with bandaids | |
22:23 | bernie | tch__: if the mysql dump isn't there, you could copy the entire /var/lib/mysql directory to the new server, but that's more of a "dirty" trick and i'd run a full dump/restore to make sure there's no corruption |
22:24 | cjl | newpootle was never advertised as active |
22:24 | bernie | tch__: no, wait... newpootle had a really old snapshot of pootle. maybe one year old |
22:24 | cjl | getting db from housetree pootle instance would be impt |
22:24 | bernie | tch__: the last state of pootle is only in the daily backups of the old pootle vm |
22:25 | cjl: we have that in the backups, but the db files might be corrupted, who knows. the disk was dying after all. | |
22:25 | tch__ | there is another issue, what we call old what version of pootle was? |
22:25 | bernie | tch__: err... dunno. older than 2.5, i think |
22:25 | tch__: it might require a more complicated migration | |
22:25 | tch__: but your predecessor could do it so it's a good sign | |
22:26 | tch__ | are you sure these were in mysql already? I thik the previous guy who worked on this had to migrated to different versions to finally migrate to 2.5 |
22:26 | bernie, I was actually thinking the opposite | |
22:26 | bernie | tch__: possibly. i remember he had all sort of trouble with migrating the data :-( |
22:26 | tch__ | bernie, to have a fresh one working and importing projects back to it |
22:26 | cjl | In worst case, I'd take a loss of work t ohave a working Pootle instance |
22:26 | bernie | tch__: but then again, he also didn't have much experience with django, mysql and all that. |
22:27 | tch__: othet than the projects, there are users with access rights, passwords, etc. | |
22:27 | tch__: maybe not enough users to care. | |
22:27 | tch__ | i don't think django is the main issue, but to understand pootle itself and then our particular way of using it |
22:27 | bernie | cjl: wouldn't the actual translation work be in the git repositories? |
22:27 | cjl: what's in the db? | |
22:28 | cjl | bernie only if committed, but most hopefully is. |
22:28 | submitted, not not *committed* would be lost. | |
22:28 | bernie | tch__: getting the git repositories from the backups should be very easy... |
22:29 | tch__ | cjl, maybe we can export it using the offline optoins and import it back? |
22:29 | cjl | PO filesimport well (usually) |
22:29 | tch__ | bernie, the thing is that we need to change repositories too, |
22:31 | cjl, going back to the pot files | |
22:31 | cjl | yeah |
22:31 | tch__ | cjl, we needed to use cli scripts to regenerate them? |
22:31 | or was cron job | |
22:31 | cjl | we did, not sure what other Pootle instances did |
22:32 | cron job | |
22:32 | code is in git "pootle-helpers" | |
22:32 | tch__ | cjl, ok |
22:32 | cjl, another topic, | |
22:32 | cjl, the current projects organization | |
22:32 | cjl | https://git.sugarlabs.org/pootle-helpers |
22:33 | tch__ | cjl, we also need the custom scripts to organize the FS to make pootle think we have fewer projects right? |
22:33 | cjl | maybe only small change from old pootle to new pootl3e |
22:34 | tch__ | to have glucose, honey, etc |
22:34 | cjl | scripts created symlinks per lang per PO |
22:35 | Not sure what issue is, Pootle handles multiple projects fine. | |
22:35 | tch__ | cjl, yeah, but real projects are not organized like that |
22:35 | ie., sugar is different project fro sugar-toolkit | |
22:36 | but we use these scripts to make it look like is one project | |
22:36 | cjl | can have multiple PO files per project, we did set each PO up pointing to it's own repo |
22:36 | Honey was essentially arbitrary grouping | |
22:36 | tch__ | my question is, do we need to preserve that organization ? |
22:37 | bernie | yes |
22:37 | sorry, responding to cjl | |
22:37 | cjl | It means a lot to developers |
22:37 | tch__ | I am just thinking about the cost it has in terms of maintainability to depend on those scripts |
22:38 | just to have it organized in that way | |
22:38 | lets say (hypothetically) that pootle can cover a basic workflow now | |
22:38 | cjl | It wsn't too bad in the past |
22:38 | tch__ | like |
22:39 | updating POT, making commits and pushing.. | |
22:39 | out of the box | |
22:39 | wouldn't it be easier to use it as it is? | |
22:40 | cjl, yeah, but in the past we had maintainers :) | |
22:40 | haha | |
22:40 | cjl | one project per PO? |
22:40 | tch__ | one project per project |
22:40 | sugar as pootle project, sugar-toolkit as another, TA as another, etc | |
22:41 | cjl | hmm |
22:41 | bernie | i think it makes more sense this way, yes |
22:41 | tch__ | I am just thinking aloud, |
22:41 | I still don't know if pootle can cover these things out of the box, | |
22:41 | bashintosh | sorry folks to drop in but, do you really need to have Pootle doing all these things, all at once, for all these users? I mean, wouldn't it be easier to start (almost) from scratch and re-architect the whole thing with a bit of maintainability in mind? At least, it would be time spent at the beginning but then much easier for others to come. Just my 2 cents, I don't yet know enough about all this |
22:41 | bundle.. | |
22:41 | tch__ | but I do know what the git integration works like that |
22:41 | bernie | tch__: i'm a bit outdated. have sugar, sugar-base and sugar-artwork been merged now? |
22:41 | tch__ | out of the box |
22:42 | bashintosh, I agree, always we can cover a decent workflow | |
22:42 | bernie, yes, sugar-base is gone | |
22:42 | bernie, sugar-artwork is still there | |
22:43 | cjl | but no strings :-) |
22:43 | bernie | bashintosh: makes sense, yes. i think tch agrees too. |
22:43 | cjl: so it doesn't matter for pootle :) | |
22:43 | cjl: then which projects would have to be split up for pootle? | |
22:43 | cjl | I'm not going to argue against any organization that can be made t owork in a maintainable fashion |
22:44 | Fructose and multiple Honeys, at least | |
22:45 | tch__ | amost of the projects I think |
22:45 | ie., sugar and sugar-toolkit are just one project in current pootle | |
22:45 | but ar different projects in git | |
22:46 | cjl | We might be able t odrop Dextrose (no AC anymore) |
22:47 | tch__ | cjl, think it would be possible to specify which projects are essential? in case we need to start from scratch |
22:47 | I know sugar is :), but what about others, like terminology | |
22:47 | (keep in mind I lack context) | |
22:47 | cjl | yes, I could list esssentials |
22:48 | tch__ | cjl, great, that makes two deliverables now :) |
22:48 | bernie | guys sorry i have to leave now |
22:48 | i'm hosting an event, people will come soon. | |
22:48 | tch__ | bernie, ok, thanks for joining bernie |
22:49 | bashintosh | bernie: see you! |
22:49 | bernie | bye! thanks for taking care of the dog (pootle) |
22:49 | bashintosh, tch__: maybe the two of you should spend some time together, going over the current pootle setup. | |
22:49 | better have two maintainers for pootle, since it's so tricky | |
22:50 | tch__ | bernie, yes, |
22:50 | bernie | bye! |
22:50 | leaves | |
22:50 | tch__ | thats why I am thinking that, if the new pootle can cover a decent workflow, we should it as it is |
22:50 | bashintosh | bernie: ciao |
22:50 | tch__ | as much as possible |
22:51 | bashintosh | tch__: are you documenting all the steps you're doing somewhere? |
22:51 | cjl | ciao bernie |
22:51 | tch__ | bashintosh, more or less, making the current instance to work was more of a try and error thing |
22:52 | walterbender | cjl, ping |
22:52 | cjl | Let me work on these edeliverables, especially what the pootle-helpers did for us. |
22:53 | walterbender: pong | |
22:53 | tch__ | cjl, thanks Chris, what I will do is see how much the new pootle can really do.. |
22:53 | walterbender | cjl, I happen to be in DC tomorrow. |
22:53 | any chance to meet for lunch? | |
22:54 | cjl | I have something around lunchtime, but maybe after? |
22:54 | walterbender | I have a 3pm meeting at the World Bank |
22:54 | but maybe dinner? | |
22:54 | cjl | Dinner would work |
22:55 | walterbender | cjl, email your phone number |
22:56 | tch__ | bashintosh, once we get a better idea of what path to follow, I will definitely need a hand to set and document everything :) |
22:56 | bashintosh | tch__: OK, it looks like a very custom edit of the original Pootle especially because there's a lot of "legacy" things that you guys are trying to get back on track. |
22:56 | tch__: you're the boss, tell me what bolts to turn :) | |
22:57 | tch__ | bashintosh, cjl I think thats it for today.. |
22:57 | bernie, bashintosh cjl thanks a lot for coming.. | |
22:57 | cjl | yep, let me work on some descriptions of old workflow |
22:58 | tch__ | cjl, many thanks |
22:58 | bashintosh | tch__: cjl bernie pleasure to be here! |
22:59 | tch__ | #endmeeting |
23:00 | maybe bernie has a control haha | |
23:01 | bashintosh | tch__: lol |
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