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#sugar-meeting meeting, 2011-08-05 15:00:58

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15:00 meeting Meeting started Fri Aug  5 15:00:58 2011 UTC. The chair is walterbender. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
15:00 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #endmeeting
15:01 walterbender alsroot and I already talked a bit about certificates, so maybe start there?
15:01 #topic certificates
15:01 I sent an email earlier, but have revised my draft proposal since then.
15:02 icarito reading backlog
15:02 walterbender #link http://fpaste.org/ihGH/
15:02 the gist of alsroot's feedback, as I understood it, is more decentralization
15:02 icarito_web <icarito_web!~webchat@jita.sugarlabs.org> has joined #sugar-meeting
15:03 walterbender so I tried to recast the program based on where authority is delegated to the teams
15:03 and I use Activities as an example
15:03 (based on a discussion on the lists)
15:03 #link http://lists.sugarlabs.org/arc[…]-July/013736.html
15:04 It is not clear whether the teams are the right place for this, but I don't know where else to delegate the responsibility.
15:04 note that this is independent of the certification process we approved for local labs several months ago
15:04 icarito_web teams are largely inoperant atm
15:05 i.e. deployment team, even activities team
15:05 walterbender well, some are and some are not
15:05 cjb sounds good to me, either walterbender's initial version or the decentralized one
15:05 icarito_web although I was glad to hear about activity team meeting happening
15:05 walterbender icarito: the activity team is very active, but perhaps not officially under that umbrella
15:06 icarito_web it sounds to me like the only dev cert we need is activities
15:06 walterbender icarito: and the design team meets almost weekly
15:06 icarito_web but the activity team structure is not active (not to say activity developers are not)
15:06 walterbender icarito as does the release team
15:06 and i18n is very active under cjl's leadership
15:06 icarito yes a team is as active as its coordinator
15:07 walterbender icarito not sure about that... but no matter
15:07 icarito but team coordinators are sometimes missing
15:07 walterbender can we wrap up the topic at hand? any comments/suggestions re the proposal?
15:07 cjb would vote +1 on it as-is
15:08 walterbender cjb: would you make a motion? (and please specify which version?)
15:09 cjb let's use your revision
15:09 could you send it to IAEP now?
15:09 walterbender icarito: certificates may serve as 'carrots' in different areas, e.g., i18n and l10n
15:09 cjb and then we can quote it in the vote
15:09 walterbender cjb: will do.
15:09 icarito i just read the final wording and I think its ok
15:10 walterbender cjb: sent
15:11 icarito i was concerned about the requirements for amount of time for contributions and also about the body that makes the decision but I think its open enough to discuss that when it pops up
15:11 walterbender icarito: I think I removed that in the latest draft
15:11 icarito: BTW, has SL Colombia issued any certificates yet?
15:11 icarito nope Local Labs are wary of certificates in general
15:11 walterbender you guys were the furthest down that path
15:12 icarito that is my impression
15:12 maybe we can issue some in peru
15:12 walterbender icarito: hmm... as I recall, you guys were the ones pressing for the program to begin with.
15:12 icarito is relocating for a season to peru with the entire family, driving a week accross southamerica with baby and all
15:13 walterbender icarito: wow
15:13 cjb MOTION: We will award certificates to developers/contributors following the description in http://lists.sugarlabs.org/arc[…]ugust/013885.html
15:13 walterbender seconded
15:13 icarito we were pressing for a services portfolio, certificates was one of the items but it was not very well received by other local labs
15:13 cjb +1
15:13 walterbender +1
15:13 alsroot +1
15:14 icarito +1
15:14 walterbender motion passes.
15:14 #action walter will solicit votes from our absent members
15:14 icarito a question is how do we rotate the coordinators of teams?
15:14 is for each team to decide but sometimes there is no team
15:14 walterbender icarito: maybe a new topic on teams in general?
15:15 icarito i have no specific proposal on the topic
15:15 walterbender icarito: but could we first discuss the NDSU proposal?
15:15 icarito so i dont want to waste the boards time
15:15 walterbender #TOPIC NDSU SL proposal
15:15 thinks it is an important topic
15:16 JT4sugar I am here along with Dr. Kevin Brooks Chair of English NDSU-IRC nic Kab
15:16 walterbender has everyone had a chance to read the NDSU proposal?
15:16 JT4sugar has been the primary liaison with them
15:16 JT4sugar: want to comment?
15:17 JT4sugar They have been involved with a SoaS project for last year at elementary school
15:17 They would like to move forward to larger Fargo community
15:17 A local Sugar Labs allows them to partner with Comp Sci Dept
15:18 cjb walterbender: sorry, I don't think I've seen it.  Where is it?
15:18 JT4sugar They also have a XO contributors program proposal in an will be hopefully working on activities fro Sugar/XO
15:19 walterbender cjb: I'll resend it.
15:19 JT4sugar kab, Would you like to pick up Dr. Brooks with quick intro
15:19 kab Thanks John.
15:20 The "SL at NDSU" would help institutionalize our project--useful for visibility and long term funding.
15:20 walterbender cjb: sent
15:21 kab The CS people have been interested but slow to join; they have some great edugames they have designed and wan to test in Sugar.
15:21 I could go on, but maybe people have questions.
15:21 cjb walterbender: I see the original went to "slob@sugarlabs.org"
15:21 walterbender cjb: it was resent to slobs
15:22 cjb ah
15:22 are you sure?
15:22 nothing matching NDSU in my slobs box before just now
15:22 icarito walterbender: same here as cjb
15:22 just reading now
15:23 walterbender cjb: I got it... but I was CC'd. Maybe it bounced
15:23 sorry about that
15:23 alsroot got both, to slobs@ and iaep@
15:24 cjb it mentions an attached XO lending request, but I don't think it's attached
15:24 walterbender cjb: I didn't forward that just now as I didn't think it was relevant
15:24 icarito looking over http://fargoxo.wordpress.com/ interesting material, would be nice to aggregate in planet.sugarlabs.org
15:25 walterbender cjb: was trying to minimize the clutter
15:25 JT4sugar cjb, Just forwarded you email with both
15:25 cjb oh, it was resent, but the resend didn't go through.. huh, I wonder why
15:26 walterbender icarito: good point re the blog. I would make including it in the planet a criteria for acceptance :P
15:26 icarito yes it also mentions a MOU
15:27 walterbender icarito ^it ?
15:27 kab We would be happy to inhabit your planet.
15:28 icarito walterbender: the email you just fwd
15:28 welcome kab :-)
15:29 walterbender icarito the MOU was attached... tell you what, I'll pastebin it.
15:29 icarito just reading at the blog i'm +1 only would like for them to have http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/S[…]Labs:_a_community in mind
15:29 ahh sorry
15:29 reads
15:31 ok looks good
15:31 walterbender http://fpaste.org/GwFR/
15:31 Any further comments?
15:32 cjb looks good so far!
15:32 walterbender hopes that this will bring NDSU into closer orbit with the rest of the community (sticking with the planet metaphor)
15:32 icarito it would be nice if we as a board could remind the existing local labs about http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/S[…]Labs:_a_community and ask the ones who havent to appoint a representative and such
15:32 walterbender icarito +1
15:33 icarito regarding NDSU looks like we can give a warm welcome ;-)
15:34 JT4sugar icarito, Appoint a representative to sit on SLOBS or report in?
15:34 icarito we come in peace
15:34 walterbender motion: Accept NDSU's proposal to create a Local Lab.
15:34 icarito JT4sugar: just a pointperson so we know who to contact and can ask what's up
15:34 JT4sugar icarito, Good point
15:35 walterbender anyone willing to second my motion?
15:35 kab It's plenty warm here this summer, but thanks for the warm welcome.  I'd be happy to sit on Slobs and/or serve as point person.
15:35 icarito JT4sugar: the MOU just reminded me about it ;-)
15:35 kab cool, no need to sit in slobs every time but of course you are welcome and encouraged as is every member of the community ;-)
15:36 +1 from me
15:36 walterbender #action attach the MOU to the meeting minutes
15:36 cjb walterbender: ok, seconded
15:36 +1
15:36 walterbender +1
15:36 alsroot +1
15:36 walterbender passed.
15:36 Welcome NDSU!!
15:37 #action walter to execute the MOU on behalf of SL
15:37 I will also solicit feedback from our absent members.
15:37 cjl is glad t onote that ND is finally a state as well,  Ithink
15:37 kab Thanks everyone.  Looking forward to meeting more of the community.
15:37 JT4sugar Appreciate the opportunty to collaborate with NDSU on a more official basis and look forward to the community benefits
15:37 walterbender Wow. We are a well-oiled machine today
15:38 kab We are a state of mind, perhaps not a state in the union.
15:38 walterbender icarito, alsroot shall we take a few minutes to talk about teams now? Unless there is other board business?
15:38 notes that MA is a Commonwealth, not a State
15:38 alsroot walterbender: +1, we need at least to start this talk..
15:39 icarito_web i just live in one big island called southamerica ;-)
15:39 walterbender #topic teams
15:39 It has been more than 3 years since we launched Sugar Labs. At the time we emphasized a decentralized model, of which teams were an important part
15:40 but maybe time to revisit this?
15:40 alsroot has an issue point w/ Dev Team goals
15:40 walterbender I am still in favor of decentralized teams but maybe they need some shepherding?
15:40 lucian <lucian!~lucian@78.86.217.168> has joined #sugar-meeting
15:40 icarito +1 looks like we have an abundance of silent teams
15:41 lots of overlap and little leadership
15:41 not complaining just thinking out loud
15:41 walterbender seems we have two issues on the table: leadership and the goals of a specific team
15:42 icarito also what is the benefit for teams to officially be and mantain status as a SL Team...?
15:42 yevlempy has quit IRC
15:42 icarito seems these tasks get done without the structure
15:42 cjl walterbender: catherding, not shepherding
15:42 icarito maybe we should generalize the idea of reminding Local Labs about http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/S[…]Labs:_a_community to include Teams as well
15:43 cjl: yes exactly
15:43 that is asking for status report and appointment of coordinators by say a specific date
15:44 alsroot icarito: +1
15:45 cjl The Translation Team (via me) has made quarterly reports to SLOBS since the idea first floated 6 months ago.
15:45 alsroot though  not appointing but asking current cooridinator(s)
15:45 and sorting out how many teams we have w/o any coordinator
15:45 walterbender I can ask for a report in time for our next meeting, say in two weeks?
15:46 icarito: can you do the same for local labs?
15:46 icarito we need a way to temporarily "stash" teams/local labs that are non responsive
15:46 walterbender icarito: why?
15:46 icarito for one thing because its misleading in the website, don't you think?
15:46 also because I think SL should have resposive organs
15:47 or not have them at all
15:47 i dont mean to suspend / remove but only to reflect the actual status
15:47 walterbender icarito: OK... as much as I hate the metaphor, I see it somewhat as a "cookie-licking issue"
15:48 alsroot yeah, thats really good point.., ie, having only well working parts and add/remove new/old in the process but keep current set all time responsible
15:48 walterbender icarito: I don't want people to feel inhibited from working on something because they don't get a response from a team
15:48 but I have no idea if it is a real issue
15:49 icarito walterbender: i think 2 weeks is a bit quick for Local Labs - I'm just arriving in 2 weeks to peru - can we say in a month from now?
15:49 walterbender icarito: sure
15:49 JT4sugar walterbender, Maybe a report plus asking what community benefitting plans the teams or labs have for next six months, might help initiate action-As people do or don't respond we will get a complete picture then adjust accordingly
15:49 walterbender JT4sugar: nice
15:50 so we have an action plan for the leadership topic at least...
15:50 alsroot +1
15:50 walterbender #action walter will contact team coordinators to ask for a report due in 1 month ; icarito will do the same for local labs
15:51 shall we set the date for our early Sept. meeting?
15:51 Sept. 9?
15:51 alsroot walterbender: that will be useful to have this date
15:51 walterbender does that interfere with Sugar Camp Paris?
15:51 or is that a plus?
15:52 cjb hm, it's the day before it
15:52 that's probably not a plus
15:52 presumably people will be traveling
15:52 icarito walterbender: lets ask for a status report, some objectives and the confirmation of the pointperson/coordinator - and lets assume no answer means we can stash the team/local lab temporarily
15:53 I already tried asking for coordinators in southamerica and only had response from peru, argentina and colombia
15:54 by stash I mean only remove the link on the side bar of the wiki and put a notice on the wiki page
15:54 JT4sugar walterbender, asking teams to have report plus plan sent to you for discussion at SLOBS on or before Paris would allow for this info to be shared in Paris and hopefully good ideas to move forward and reenergize stalled efforts
15:54 icarito do you think that is too severe?
15:55 walterbender icarito Let's wait to hear back before we talk action
15:55 ^talk^take
15:55 cjl icarito removing link from sidebar is too severe and discourages someone from taking on leadership.  Note it on the team page
15:56 alsroot icarito: actually we can make a decision after getting more clean picture
15:56 icarito also do you think we can put this in a motion to give it some oficialness?
15:56 i'm ok with not removing until we hear back - hoping we hear back ;-)
15:56 walterbender icarito I think we are agreed to put into motion the reporting process
15:56 icarito yes
15:56 alsroot thinks having clean picture for teams/labs (and having an intention to keep it uptodate) is a huge plus itself
15:57 kab has quit IRC
15:57 walterbender icarito and then let's see where we stand... hopefully it will light a fire under some of our more quiet colleagues
15:57 alsroot: +1
15:57 icarito yes I don't expect we'll have to remove much if anything
15:57 walterbender so, let's perhaps plan to meet on the 16th, but I'll ask for the reports on due on the 9th
15:58 icarito but the intention to keep the sidebar up to date to reflect the community is important +1 alsroot
15:58 walterbender icarito I agree... and perhaps this exercise will lead to some reorg
15:58 alsroot walterbender: +1
15:58 JT4sugar walterbender, Asking them what they believe they need to be more successful may also yield some important info and areas we can identify and work on
15:59 walterbender JT4sugar: maybe you can help me draft some questions... we can also lean on cjl whose i18n report was very informative
15:59 icarito already noted in my calendar - lets ask for the status report to be sent to both SLOBs and (IAEP or Sur) for the cases where they may be in Spanish
15:59 walterbender alsroot: regarding your issue, perhaps you can play a role in drafting the devel team report?
15:59 cjl walterbender: I found my March one, but I thought  I had sent another mor erecently. .
16:00 JT4sugar walterbender, Sure early next week Tuesday would be good for me
16:00 walterbender cjl: I thought so too.
16:00 icarito cjl: you are the exemplary team ;-) just so you have an idea
16:00 alsroot walterbender: thats *too* slippery :), I guess erikos and silbe are current dev team coordinators
16:00 cjl looking at lists to find second
16:01 walterbender ok... it is an hour
16:01 we should end the formal meeting
16:01 alsroot walterbender: but I can provide my vision for Platform Team
16:01 walterbender alsroot: +1
16:02 cjl March L10n report http://lists.laptop.org/piperm[…]March/002851.html
16:02 icarito ok we have an #action but no motion -
16:02 guess we can do with that
16:02 walterbender icarito: we don't need to vote on this...
16:02 icarito ok
16:02 seems we are agreed anyhow and also reflects past motions about this
16:02 cjl June L10n report  http://lists.laptop.org/piperm[…]-June/002970.html
16:03 walterbender well, thanks for attending today and for staying on topic...
16:03 any last words for the official transcript?
16:04 3
16:04 2
16:04 1
16:04 #endmeeting
16:04 meeting Meeting ended Fri Aug  5 16:04:21 2011 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. (v 0.1.4)
16:04 Minutes: http://meeting.sugarlabs.org/s[…]-05T15:00:58.html
16:04 Log:     http://meeting.sugarlabs.org/s[…]11-08-05T15:00:58

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