Time |
Nick |
Message |
11:02 |
SeanDaly |
Hi Caroline! |
11:03 |
|
Walter is in ttransit won't be with us today |
11:03 |
mchua |
SeanDaly: wrists hanging in there... I think i can abuse them for an hour if I rest most of the rest of the day :) |
11:03 |
SeanDaly |
mchua: use brainwaves don't type too much |
11:03 |
|
OK I want to get started because a lot to cover |
11:04 |
|
Sorry I was last-minutes with the agenda lots of activity this past week |
11:04 |
|
First off the run of 100 branded USB sticks |
11:05 |
|
I had some assistance from Anne Gentle whose friend annd neighbor works for a proomo priinting place |
11:05 |
|
and has a supplier for USB keys and will do them at cost and in time for FOSSVT |
11:06 |
|
At $9 per unit more than I planned but I ran out of time to work with unknowns and be 100% sure we would make the date |
11:06 |
|
For this price they will preload the SoaS image of our choice |
11:07 |
|
they claim to have tested a bootable GNU/Linux image fingers crossed they can do it, it's new for them |
11:07 |
|
There will be 3 color variations on a white key, echoing Christian's site |
11:07 |
tomeu |
is here |
11:07 |
SeanDaly |
with colored lanyards (non-branded) |
11:07 |
|
hi tomeu |
11:07 |
caroline |
sounds great! |
11:08 |
mchua |
Gorgeous. |
11:08 |
erikos |
sounds nice indeed to have different colors |
11:08 |
SeanDaly |
they will be delivered directly to Caroline target date is April 7th |
11:08 |
|
Yes I am very pleased there will be three colors |
11:08 |
erikos |
SeanDaly: when do we have to ship the image for the stick? |
11:08 |
SeanDaly |
erikos: I will know tomorrow |
11:09 |
erikos |
SeanDaly: ok |
11:09 |
SeanDaly |
logo colors will probbably be related to lanyard colors, final choice not made yet |
11:09 |
jt4sugar |
Are we including testing instructions on stick |
11:09 |
SeanDaly |
I'd like to get a photo with the three coolored sticks in the foreground and 3 machines running it in the background :-) |
11:10 |
erikos |
tomeu: i guess this release is why we need soas-1 |
11:10 |
|
tomeu: by the 7th of april - ~3 days |
11:10 |
tomeu |
erikos: yup, looks like that |
11:10 |
SeanDaly |
jt4sugar: I would very much like to, re item 7 on the agenda |
11:11 |
caroline |
can we get browse to have sugarlabs.org as a home page? |
11:11 |
SeanDaly |
caroline: +1 |
11:11 |
erikos |
caroline: i guess that is doable |
11:11 |
|
takes notes |
11:12 |
SeanDaly |
Re SoaS-1 or -2: my idea was that FOSSVT would be a ttrampoline to annnounce "official beta" of SoaS-2 |
11:12 |
|
and renew call for testers |
11:12 |
|
of course, being careful not to oversell |
11:13 |
erikos |
SeanDaly: i want to discuss this a bit with sebastian |
11:13 |
|
SeanDaly: not sure - what the best choice is at the moment |
11:13 |
|
SeanDaly: but soas-2 (F11) is still very rough |
11:13 |
SeanDaly |
erikos: yes of course if it is too early to do a press push we can wait |
11:13 |
erikos |
SeanDaly: and integration work is hard - ask tomeu :/ |
11:14 |
|
SeanDaly: at the moment - *we* are the testers for F11 :) |
11:14 |
tomeu |
erikos: the upside is that we don't have any pending bugs on soas-2, right? |
11:14 |
SeanDaly |
To be clear, soft press release= published on our press page, "hard" press release = PR Newswire |
11:14 |
erikos |
SeanDaly: yes - sure |
11:14 |
mchua |
caroline: oy - i dropped the ball on fossvt, should I still try to go since I'm mostly only useful in person these days? |
11:15 |
erikos |
tomeu: hmm can you rephrase? |
11:15 |
SeanDaly |
We could go with another angle: working on making feedback very easy |
11:15 |
caroline |
yes you should try to go |
11:15 |
tomeu |
erikos: that we have solved (or know how to solve) all bugs that were found in soas-2 |
11:15 |
mchua |
i'm happy to keep visiting the soas schools with caroline to test f11 and etc if that's helpful - just learning that i need help typing bug reports :) |
11:15 |
caroline |
and try to have some time beforehand to help us get ready. |
11:16 |
tomeu |
mchua: find a small cousin to be your secretary |
11:16 |
SeanDaly |
re FOSSVT and LinuxTag etc., I'd like to share a secret to success booth marketing |
11:16 |
tomeu |
you may need tons of ice cream, though |
11:16 |
SeanDaly |
"balloons" |
11:17 |
tomeu |
heh |
11:17 |
SeanDaly |
Brandable and attracts kids (& grownups) |
11:17 |
erikos |
and a clown to hand them out? |
11:17 |
SeanDaly |
inexpensive, suppliers everywhere |
11:17 |
erikos |
wants to be the clown |
11:17 |
SeanDaly |
I'd love to be the clown but i'm afraid I won't make this one |
11:17 |
mchua |
can tie balloon animals |
11:17 |
erikos |
mchua: whoooo |
11:17 |
mchua |
tomeu: ooo. I might try that. |
11:18 |
SeanDaly |
mchua: another secret ttalent! |
11:18 |
tomeu |
at fisl 2007 I had a bad experience with giving away olpc tshirts, at some point the people wanting tshirts displaced the ones interested in olpc |
11:18 |
SeanDaly |
Black logo on any color balloon should look fine |
11:18 |
erikos |
tomeu: you mean all the bugs are in rawhide at the moment - not ours? |
11:18 |
SeanDaly |
balloons cheaper than swag :-) |
11:18 |
|
and MUCH cheaper than USB sticks :-) |
11:18 |
erikos |
tomeu: good point |
11:18 |
tomeu |
erikos: no, that we don't have any known integration bugs in soas-2 |
11:19 |
erikos |
tomeu: yeah - it is not in our hand really |
11:19 |
SeanDaly |
balloons: tough choice is between helium (kids prefer) and air (budget preferes) |
11:19 |
tomeu |
iptables, policykit, NM, write, etc. solved them already |
11:19 |
erikos |
tomeu: solved-->hacked ;) |
11:20 |
tomeu |
right ;) |
11:20 |
mchua |
balloons for those who play with sugar - try our soas station, get a balloon |
11:20 |
caroline |
is this for a specific conference? |
11:20 |
SeanDaly |
mchua: +1 |
11:20 |
tomeu |
cool |
11:20 |
SeanDaly |
Caroline: it could be for any conference what about FOSSVT? too serious? :-) |
11:21 |
caroline |
we won't have a booth |
11:21 |
|
we have a talk |
11:21 |
|
so not applicable. |
11:21 |
SeanDaly |
caroline: my confusion |
11:22 |
|
caroline: although if you get on the podium with soome balloons everybody there will know Sugar is fun :D |
11:22 |
|
agenda item 2 we had spoken about a "developer press release" |
11:22 |
|
erikos, tomeu, do we have a message to get out? |
11:23 |
caroline |
on the SoaS image for FOSSVT can we include IRC defaulted to #sugar? |
11:23 |
erikos |
SeanDaly: you mean the OLPCNews article? |
11:23 |
tomeu |
SeanDaly: not sure I heard about that before |
11:24 |
mchua |
http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/M[…]lopers/Sugar_0.84 ? |
11:24 |
tomeu |
caroline: on this soas-2, it goes to #sugar and #olpc-help |
11:24 |
SeanDaly |
erikos: no, we had talked a few weeks ago about informing developers where we are since the "public" press release for parents & teachers was very general |
11:24 |
mchua |
can we schedule and announce some "new dev start parties" on irc and plug them at the end of that announcement? |
11:24 |
tomeu |
SeanDaly: so about what has been released, not where are we going? |
11:24 |
SeanDaly |
I'm not sure if we need to do a soft release like that |
11:24 |
erikos |
SeanDaly: well we could use the release notes for that |
11:25 |
SeanDaly |
tomeu: could be |
11:25 |
mchua |
some people really need a "show up here at X time and Y place and we'll get you going" thing, esp folks new to OSS |
11:25 |
tomeu |
btw, gnome does a press release every time they make a release? I think I have never seen one |
11:25 |
SeanDaly |
again, i'm not saying we need that, but if our press page has a developer-specific release talking distribution tech perhaps it could help us with distributions & oems? |
11:27 |
erikos |
tomeu: what we could/should do is to announce the release page |
11:27 |
|
tomeu: on the ml - the blogs etc |
11:27 |
|
tomeu: that we have not done so yet |
11:27 |
tomeu |
SeanDaly: hmm, so who is the audience and what do we want to communicate? |
11:28 |
|
SeanDaly: the article of olpc news was intended to show how sugar moves towards engaging people in modifying and creating their own tools |
11:28 |
|
might not be the same idea, right? |
11:28 |
|
erikos: yeah, I guess you are right |
11:29 |
SeanDaly |
grrr intterrupted by phone |
11:30 |
erikos |
tomeu: we could as well wait until our update release is out though |
11:30 |
SeanDaly |
If we don't have a message to get out at the moment, we can save the effort :D but the original conncern was that we were addressing the public to be rreassuring & informative, but not out partners in development |
11:30 |
|
s/out/our |
11:31 |
tomeu |
I see |
11:31 |
SeanDaly |
Right now I'm leaning towards FOSSVT as the next release |
11:31 |
|
s/release/press release |
11:31 |
|
depending on what we want to say, can be with or without PR Newswire |
11:31 |
tomeu |
I have my mind pretty much filled up right now, but if someone thinks we should address to some people with something technical, can give a hand |
11:32 |
jt4sugar |
The best target audience would be University Computer Science Students all have projects to do-Talk about Sugar, Python and the possibilities of Collaboration |
11:32 |
SeanDaly |
Actually Ii think organizing feedback in a useful & manageable way is more urgent |
11:32 |
tomeu |
SeanDaly: so the audience would be "partners in development"? who would that people be? |
11:32 |
SeanDaly |
developers, developers, developers, developers, developers, developers, developers, |
11:33 |
tomeu |
generic developers? ;) |
11:33 |
SeanDaly |
keep in mind I don't know about paddling upstream vs. downstream |
11:33 |
caroline |
Linux developes, game developers, python developers, VMWare developers, people who think BIOS on computes s facinating... |
11:33 |
|
we need to diversify a bit |
11:33 |
tomeu |
I guess activity developers are our most consistent development community |
11:33 |
SeanDaly |
But in my mind this is part of how we get included (& promoted!) on distributions |
11:34 |
jt4sugar |
Budding developers at Universities throughout the world-Get them a Starter Pack |
11:34 |
tomeu |
right now I mean, in the future this should change |
11:34 |
SeanDaly |
with activities.sugarlabs.org we will shortly be ready to scale in terms of number of Activities |
11:34 |
caroline |
maybe a press release when we hit 100 activities? or 250? |
11:35 |
SeanDaly |
I've been impressed with the number of GSoC applicants |
11:35 |
caroline |
When/how do you want to publicize our pilot with GPA? |
11:35 |
SeanDaly |
caroline: +1 great idea - an easy-to-remember milestone |
11:35 |
|
caroline: which one iis that? |
11:36 |
caroline |
Gardner Pilot Academy in alston our SoaS pilot |
11:36 |
SeanDaly |
caroline: ah yes 3rd time you've reminded me GPA=Gardner |
11:36 |
|
Best way I think is with film, photos |
11:36 |
|
Youtube |
11:37 |
|
We should be planning a countdown to SoaS v1.0 |
11:37 |
mchua |
notes there are 23 mins left |
11:37 |
|
;) |
11:37 |
caroline |
Should we wait till we have SoaS runing there or do one as is on the school? |
11:37 |
SeanDaly |
With an event or press release of news at least every 6 weeks |
11:37 |
|
caroline: I feel it's like the USB sticks: even something basic will be seed to go further afterwards |
11:38 |
caroline |
sounds good. I will coordinate with you offline |
11:38 |
SeanDaly |
The "images" i would like to see on Youtube are: class of kids, 2 or 3 different machines running Sugar, kids collaborating |
11:38 |
|
Closeup of Sugar screen |
11:39 |
|
OK I'm looking at the clock on item 4 of the agenda, the printable PDF |
11:39 |
|
caroline I'm going to ask Christian if he can assist me with that |
11:40 |
|
basically I just want to condense some text from the static site explaiining Sugar, a Mike Lee photo, a screenshot |
11:40 |
|
I want to return to the feedback question but before I do, |
11:41 |
|
We need to choose an update to the phrase: "Spin-off of the "Sugar" desktop environment to another project." |
11:41 |
|
Concise |
11:41 |
|
for example, "Makers of the Sugar Learning Platform for children" |
11:42 |
tomeu |
that's nice |
11:42 |
SeanDaly |
^^that's descriptive, but it's dull |
11:42 |
tomeu |
is dull |
11:42 |
SeanDaly |
Some help please for a snappy poppy phrase which will induce clicking ! :-) |
11:42 |
tomeu |
finest cookers of Sugar |
11:43 |
SeanDaly |
or maybe a first dull phrase, then a crackiling one |
11:43 |
caroline |
Crystalizers of Sugar |
11:43 |
SeanDaly |
Could be a call to action: "Kids love to learn with Sugar, try it on your computer" |
11:45 |
|
Or fantastical: "from the magic land of free software" |
11:45 |
|
or down-to-earth: "Sugar is used by hundreds of thousands of children every schools day" |
11:46 |
|
Please send suggestions to the list, Luke said he would help us get that indexed |
11:46 |
|
any other topics before I return to "feedback"? |
11:46 |
jt4sugar |
Sugar: Where Learning to Learn is Sweet-try it out! |
11:47 |
SeanDaly |
jt4sugar: I like that |
11:48 |
|
by the way I plan to contact the Chicago and Co. Cork Ireland schools who will be working together this fall |
11:48 |
tomeu |
I hope we can choose one quickly |
11:48 |
|
anything will be better than what we have now |
11:48 |
SeanDaly |
tomeu: if we can't we'll just go with factual even that will be bettter than what it is today |
11:49 |
|
although I am very pleased at how reliable our referencing has become, the media launch did that i think |
11:49 |
|
OK re feedback: I was looking at Survey Monkey |
11:49 |
tomeu |
google has always indexed very well olpc and sugarlabs sites |
11:50 |
SeanDaly |
tomeu: yes the challenge we had was that tthe wiki was better referenced than the static intro |
11:50 |
tomeu |
I remember trying to google for apis we use in sugar, and find first indexed sugar code than the api docs |
11:50 |
SeanDaly |
and, we still need to work on improving navigation between the 3 sections |
11:51 |
jt4sugar |
SeanDaly: Did they survey the 600 Uruguay Teachers? |
11:51 |
SeanDaly |
Survey Monkey is a cheap SaS solution for taking questionnaires as short or long as you like |
11:51 |
|
jt4sugar: my understanding from Walter is that hasn't been done yet |
11:52 |
jt4sugar |
SeanDaly: ok |
11:52 |
SeanDaly |
Survey Monkey has been used by NGOs and big companies, since fast & easy to deploy |
11:52 |
caroline |
survey monkey +1 for easy, |
11:52 |
SeanDaly |
and data exportable |
11:53 |
|
actually the "easy" part is the questionnaire |
11:53 |
|
the hard part is handling the data in a useful way |
11:53 |
jt4sugar |
Does it have translation abilities? |
11:54 |
SeanDaly |
jt4sugar: you mean multilanguage questions, or translation of data? |
11:54 |
|
I'd be surprised if translation of data was in there |
11:55 |
|
A "brute-force" approach could be: get a few hundred or more responses in several languages, |
11:55 |
|
and index by weighted synonyms such as "boot" or "freeze" |
11:55 |
|
Another approach: upload of a logfile? |
11:56 |
|
If easy enough for tester, could be an easy-to-parse source of info across configs |
11:57 |
|
I don't want to directly connect web-facing feedback to us, |
11:57 |
jt4sugar |
SeanDaly: since many Teachers using Sugar speak Spanish at the moment this is important to think about |
11:57 |
SeanDaly |
but to gather lots of data and "distill" it into findingd |
11:57 |
|
s/findingd/findings/ |
11:58 |
|
For example, when I boot SoaS on my French keyboards it types qwerty I need to type blind |
11:58 |
tomeu |
several people from deployments have offered to summarize and translate the feedback from there |
11:58 |
SeanDaly |
but I'm not sure how or whom to tell about that |
11:58 |
tomeu |
not yet from .uy, though |
11:58 |
|
http://sugarlabs.org/go/DeploymentTeam/Places |
11:59 |
|
I hope we can process manually that feedback, it can be invaluable |
11:59 |
SeanDaly |
tomeu: if we can find a few hardy souls willing to help us compile questions |
11:59 |
tomeu |
hmm, I think I saw a good set of questions already? |
11:59 |
SeanDaly |
We can say upfront that although we cannot respond to each report, assistance is invaluable |
12:00 |
|
in the backoffice if we have a fairly usable way to stock the data we can already do loys of stuff with text searches, tagging, starring for interest level, etc. |
12:00 |
|
s/loys/lots/ |
12:00 |
tomeu |
SeanDaly: asking which are the 5 worst issues in sugar, the 5 best things and the 5 most pressing missing features, would be already quite good |
12:00 |
SeanDaly |
tomeu: +1 |
12:01 |
tomeu |
if they get to write an essay each, will be very hard to get useful data from there |
12:01 |
|
(though could do lovely stories) |
12:01 |
SeanDaly |
And, "what did you want to do with Sugar that you found difficult or impossible?" |
12:01 |
jt4sugar |
We should think of two types of surveys 1. Teacher/Student-Activities use/Lesson plans 2. Software testing-Technical survey |
12:01 |
tomeu |
yup |
12:01 |
|
jt4sugar: actually, hpachas-PE said that in peru they are working on a testing protocol |
12:02 |
SeanDaly |
tomeu: I believe very important to have freeform field because that's where people really express frustration, admiration, etc. |
12:02 |
tomeu |
SeanDaly: that's fine, but maybe we won't get that info summarized and translated |
12:02 |
SeanDaly |
Best-practice surveys are multiple-choice for easy data analysis reporting with freeform at the end |
12:02 |
hpachas-PE |
tomeu, yes |
12:02 |
|
tomeu, te envio nuestro protocolo |
12:03 |
SeanDaly |
Again, I'm not suggesting systelatic analysis |
12:03 |
tomeu |
hpachas-PE: awesome! |
12:03 |
SeanDaly |
s/systelatic/systematic |
12:03 |
hpachas-PE |
tomeu, listo , lo tienes en tu mail |
12:04 |
SeanDaly |
My concept is: we get data - we thank for data - we run cursory analysis by e.g. keywords or multiple-choice answers - we look at freeform to see if patterns emerge |
12:04 |
|
* I wish I spoke Spanish |
12:04 |
|
on my list for next year :-) |
12:05 |
|
For action, tomeu perhaps we coould get in sync concerning what's being done in UY and PE? |
12:05 |
|
and liaising with country contacts |
12:06 |
|
I have no doubt deployments want us to listen |
12:06 |
mchua |
Do we need olpc-sur weekly list summaries again? |
12:06 |
SeanDaly |
And, what they want to tell us may surprise us :-) |
12:06 |
|
mchua: sorry not sure what that was? |
12:07 |
tomeu |
SeanDaly: yup, though walter is the best informed one, I think |
12:07 |
mchua |
There is a Spanish language class in Boston looking for a way to help, and I can see if they would bite. (And others may know other Spanish classes that would bite.) |
12:07 |
tomeu |
mchua: I think it would be great |
12:07 |
SeanDaly |
I'll be seeing Walter in Paris in a week he will be able to debrief me better than e-mail |
12:07 |
jt4sugar |
Need Use Survey:How are you using Sugar? What activities are you using? To teach what subjects? How do you use the collaboration features of Sugar? |
12:07 |
tomeu |
mchua: also olpc-uruguay, etc |
12:07 |
mchua |
SeanDaly: olpc-sur = spanish language discussion list, many uy & pe teachers |
12:07 |
|
tomeu: ahh, yes - any others? |
12:08 |
SeanDaly |
mchua +1 for Spanish class they could be very useful |
12:08 |
|
can anyone point me to the oolpc mailing lists page? |
12:08 |
tomeu |
mchua: I would check which ones in http://lists.laptop.org/ have traffic, I'm only in olpc-sur |
12:09 |
mchua |
tomeu: will do. |
12:09 |
cjl |
lists.laptop.org |
12:09 |
SeanDaly |
cjl: thank you |
12:09 |
|
Google had 3 different links |
12:10 |
|
OK everybody I'm going to wind it down unless there is anyything else? |
12:10 |
|
going once... |
12:10 |
|
going twice... |
12:11 |
|
#endmeeting |