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#sugar-meeting, 2016-04-01

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08:17 kaametza hi all
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16:19 llaske That's me or the meeting is late ?
16:25 cjl llaske: I think it is 1700 UTC  http://www.timeanddate.com/cou[…]ril+1st&font=slab
16:26 llaske waooo, miss that :-(
16:27 thanks
16:27 cjl np
16:31 llaske: sorry  Friday, 1 April at 19:00 UTC
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18:56 Quozl` GrannieB: hello.
18:56 GrannieB Hi James!
18:57 walterbender any SLOB members here?
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18:58 walterbender Hola JM_
18:58 meeting <Jose_Miguel-es> Hello!
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18:58 walterbender bonsoir llaske
18:59 llaske Hi Walter :-)
18:59 walterbender we need one more for our quorum
18:59 ClaudiaU_, CanoeBerry ???
18:59 llaske Is it the usual time for the SLOB meeting ?
18:59 walterbender llaske, yes
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19:00 llaske hmmm with DST, it's not at all the same hour here than last month
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19:01 samsongoddy Hello all
19:01 tony376 hello
19:01 llaske Hi Samson
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19:01 walterbender OK. Let's get started
19:01 CanoeBerry hi
19:01 walterbender #startmeeting
19:01 meeting Meeting started Fri Apr  1 19:01:31 2016 UTC. The chair is walterbender. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
19:01 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #endmeeting
19:01 samsongoddy Hello llaske
19:01 ElVerma Hello!
19:01 walterbender welcome everyone
19:01 lots to cover today
19:01 Here is the agenda
19:01 1. Google Summer of Code status (Walter) -- time sensitive
19:01 2. I18n
19:01    (a) Manager discussion (Tony)
19:01    (b) Request from Edgar Quispe to attend Traducción e interpretación en las lenguas originarias del Perú meeting in Lima (Walter and CJL) -- time sensitive
19:01    (c) Proposal from Samson Goddy re i18n in Nigeria (Walter and CJL)
19:01    (d) Sugar Translation Projects Fund proposal (Laura)
19:02 3. Sugar Vision (Lionel)
19:02 4. Proposed rules for removal and replacement of SLOB members (Adam)
19:02 5. Treasurer position and process (Caryl)
19:02 6. Wiki Cleanup Party planning (Walter)
19:02 #topic GSoC
19:02 This is quick
19:02 We have 62 applications
19:02 samsongoddy wow that huge
19:02 walterbender Several of us have reviewed all of them and there are 23 very strong proposals
19:02 We need to review them in detail over the next week and submit a proposal to Google
19:02 samsongoddy can i help with that??
19:03 walterbender I am anticipating that we will only be able to offer internships to 25%
19:03 llaske Not time to have a look on it. The tool have changed so we can't give a note each
19:03 may be we could share something to give evaluation
19:03 walterbender It is not too late to sign up as a mentor to become part of the review team
19:03 samsongoddy okay
19:04 walterbender llaske, davelab6 has made a google doc that is a bit easier to browse
19:04 it is in the email from earlier in the week
19:04 llaske ok, but miss a column for each mentor no ?
19:04 walterbender llaske, we can add a column :)
19:04 davelab6 yes :)
19:05 llaske okay, so each mentor could give its evaluation in a column
19:05 walterbender any questions re GSoC?
19:05 llaske between 1 and 5
19:05 walterbender I brought it up first because it is time sensitive
19:05 llaske okay
19:05 GrannieB are there any mentorships for folks with limited coding experience but lots of documentation experience? Like me...
19:06 walterbender GrannieB, there is a documentation aspect to all of the coding tasks
19:07 OK... we should jump into the big topic.
19:07 #topic I18n
19:07 tony376, the floor is yours
19:07 davelab6 GrannieB: +1 to walterbender, and also there are a few proposals to work on the website redesign so i hope that one of those makes the cut
19:08 kaametza hello everybody
19:08 CanoeBerry tony376: insane that you stayed up til 3am in the Philippines (?) but THX if so!
19:08 walterbender The first subtopic is the i18n manager role
19:09 tony376 I understand we need to provide a request to Conservancy for this position
19:09 kaametza hope you guys understood had enough time to review the fund's motions ;D
19:09 walterbender tony376, yes... we just need to define the role and the deliverables and they will write up a contract
19:10 kaametza guys will be smart to keep them in logical order, and considering that the statement of work from the Trip Advisor grant states that "...we would use the Tripadvisor donation as the initial basis of a fund to help translation efforts...", it is logical to start with the fund related motions.
19:10 tony376 I have sent out a draft to the localization committee and so far it seems accepted
19:10 walterbender tony376, who is on that committee?
19:10 samsongoddy But i thought that Chris was appointed
19:10 kaametza so before asking the conservancy we should have a clear vision
19:10 tony376 There are 11 I believe. I can get the names from the mailing list
19:10 walterbender samsongoddy, we need to formalize things
19:11 samsongoddy sure
19:11 but it seems like chris is not online
19:11 kaametza before asking anything from the conservancy^^
19:11 cjl samsongoddy: I'm here
19:11 kaametza sorry
19:11 walterbender tony376, I suggest that you distribute the proposal to SLOBs and CC the usual lists and then we can vote by email
19:11 samsongoddy how are you doing??
19:11 davelab6 Quozl`: thanks for your tail spinning :) looking forward to llaske vision section of the meeting
19:12 llaske :-)
19:12 tony376 ok
19:12 samsongoddy my health is killing me right now
19:12 walterbender tony376, there is the position definition itself
19:12 Claudia_ <Claudia_!~webchat@rev-18-85-44-69.sugarlabs.org> has joined #sugar-meeting
19:12 walterbender and the proposal to appoint cjl
19:12 we should vote on both
19:13 Claudia_ Hello
19:13 CanoeBerry Hi!
19:13 Claudia_ my chat was frozen.. sorry
19:13 samsongoddy Hi
19:13 meeting <Jose_Miguel-es> Hello
19:13 tony376 I think we need a motion to create the position and to provide the definition to the Conservancy
19:14 CanoeBerry tony376: plz outline the position, thanks.
19:14 walterbender tony376, without the details it is hard to vote on the motion
19:14 tony376 I like the title Translation Manager
19:15 CanoeBerry Works for me.  Roles?
19:15 walterbender do you have bullet points fot the role itself?
19:15 tony376 L10n leadership tasks:  Monitoring new activity development and advocating for i18n of code (gettext formatting for Python activities, other similar methods for JavaScript work).  Setting up new languages for availability in Pootle.  Act as Sugar Labs i18n coordinator for oversight of performance on contracts to develop L10n projects approved by SLOBs.  Reaching upstream to create the glibc locales for new languages required for them
19:17 The list is a bit scrambled. But these are the bullets on the wiki page we set up to document the position
19:17 kaametza @Tony isn't "oversight of performance on contracts to develop L10n projects" too much responsability for a single person?
19:17 walterbender tony376, looks good to me
19:17 tony376 How many people does it take?
19:17 cjl kaametza: Has not been in the past
19:18 kaametza in
19:18 Proposed New Motion:
19:18 The present SugarLabs Oversight board appoints the current Translation's Committee, with the full responsability of reviewing, upgrading, approving and overseeing Sugar Translation Projects and Proposals made by any interested party, with special attention to Native Languages communities.
19:18 samsongoddy I already said that i will like to work with the Translations manager
19:18 walterbender kaametza, The manager can ask for help but has the ultimate responsibity
19:18 Claudia_ I am hoping this role with facilitate that the work happens, but it would also make possible coordination with the community and communication with the larger organization/board
19:18 tony376 Subject to the board
19:18 ElVerma has quit IRC
19:18 kaametza there is Committe that can do a better job than any single individual
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19:19 Quozl` the board seeks to delegate some responsibility.
19:19 GrannieB This is not the time for a new motion
19:19 samsongoddy kaametza, i understand your point
19:19 but i think it should be giving to one person
19:19 kaametza samsongoddy, thanks
19:19 CanoeBerry tony376: there is behind-the-scenes "engineering" leadership and there is direct "community" leadership.  Both matter.  You've focused on the former.  What room is there for the latter?  (perhaps blogging/reporting on a regularly schedule, or any other kinds of "activist" cultivation impactful translation communities we yet be aware of, volunteer or paid?)
19:19 samsongoddy then others can help
19:19 kaametza yours is an ecxample of a work made in colaboration ;D
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19:20 tony376 I think you are looking at a broader problem. We now have several mailing lists including one on localization.
19:21 walterbender In my opinion, the manager can distribute the work in whatever manner he or she feels is suitable
19:21 kaametza samsongoddy, Tony and Caryl are co-founders of the translation Committe
19:21 there are 13 of us, Tony can you please confirm?
19:21 walterbender to Adam's point there is a reporting requirement which must be in the contract
19:22 GrannieB Does Tony have a motion already under consideration? Could it be voted on? You will run out of time if you don't move along
19:22 tony376 I am not good at multitasking, to get the list I won't be able to follow the thread here.
19:22 walterbender kaametza, we have had a i18n team for 8+ years now
19:23 kaametza walterbender, I know still I'm taking about the Committe, those are diferent concepts
19:23 samsongoddy i haven't heard from martin since
19:23 kaametza Tehe Committe is an organizartional figure
19:23 diferent form the team
19:23 walterbender we are dancing in circles
19:23 CanoeBerry tony376: will you publish the role/summary you mentioned this wkd, to be voted on within the 7 days that follow per Walter's suggestion?
19:24 GrannieB Samson and I both have motions on the agenda and have to leave at the hour
19:24 walterbender the point is do we agree to have a manager
19:24 GrannieB vote
19:24 walterbender the manager will organize from there
19:24 tony376 Yes - in essence it is already posted on the wiki page
19:24 CanoeBerry URL?
19:25 tony376 http://www.sugarlabs.org/go/Tranlation_Proposal
19:26 kaametza the Manager must serve the best interests of the Sugar Translation Project.
19:26 Fund, sorry
19:26 tony376 sorry, wiki.sugarlabs.org
19:26 CanoeBerry tony376: what is the proposed salary structure?
19:26 ElVerma https://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/[…]nslation_Proposal
19:26 tony376 You had proposed $1000 per month
19:27 samsongoddy sounds cool
19:27 kaametza you guys I'm feeling ignored again :(
19:27 GrannieB who proposed $1000/mo?
19:27 tony376 Canoe Berry
19:28 walterbender #link https://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/[…]nslation_Proposal
19:28 llaske It's lot of money for an organisation like SugarLabs
19:28 kaametza before appointing anybody for anything, the Board should create the translation fund
19:28 GrannieB The url above goes to a page without any info on it. Is there another?
19:29 samsongoddy i will be logging out exactly 9pm, i am in a cyber cafe
19:29 tony376 http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Translation_Proposal
19:29 kaametza plese take a look at the motions at the pad Purpose
19:29 walterbender GrannieB, where do you see the reference to $1000?
19:29 kaametza The purpose of the fund is to serve as a source of capital for any interested Sugar Labs member to be able to complete and/or manage one or more Sugar Translation Project.
19:29 walterbender kaametza, please wait.
19:29 kaametza, we are discussing the manager role
19:30 GrannieB I suggest you need to move forward on the Tony's general motion and the question of whether you will even have a Translation Manager… vote on it and go on with the other items in the agenda
19:30 CanoeBerry tony376: what's the proposed frequency of checkpoints (presumably reporting to SL Board, with high-level goals refined by SLOBS a couple/few times per year?)
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19:30 llaske You know my position on this: putting money on localization is interested only if it's a way to increase the community
19:30 tony376 I would like a monthly report similar to Walter's. The board can review progress at any meeting.
19:30 GrannieB walter… look above at the entries at 12:26
19:30 walterbender tony376, +1
19:30 kaametza sorry walter, I exmplained on the last email
19:31 I do agree with the Manager position, in general terms
19:31 Claudia_ In agreement with the monthly reports
19:31 kaametza but you sneed to understand that by contract you need to create the fund first
19:32 CanoeBerry tony376: monthly reports are a heartbeat, but i believe that such a contract needs to half teeth--with quarterly checkpoints pegged to actual calendar months, or every 6 months.
19:32 cjl quarterly is not unreasonable.
19:32 walterbender CanoeBerry, I think quarterly goals
19:32 tony376 I strongly disagree. Much of what the manager must do is manage. Much of the tasks will be ongoing.
19:32 CanoeBerry Works for me.
19:32 walterbender but monthly updates
19:32 GrannieB I also agree with lionel's position on this.  But, I don't get to vote!
19:33 llaske Thanks GrannieB :-)
19:33 GrannieB +1 to Tony
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19:33 kaametza when you wrote the statement of work from the Trip Advisor grant, you made a commitment in the name of SL to create such fund
19:34 samsongoddy_ hmm
19:34 davelab6 i agree with llaske and GrannieB
19:34 CanoeBerry Quaterly or twice a year report keep community honesty in the loop at all levels.  Nobody likes writing a report a couple times per year until it's done...
19:34 walterbender kaametza, please let us finish one discussion first
19:34 llaske but we need to have a good strategy to use the Trip Advisor money
19:34 kaametza the distribution of funds then needs to be made by a fund
19:34 not by the sLOBS
19:34 llaske not translate in any language
19:34 kaametza llaske, we need vision are clear rules
19:34 GrannieB +1
19:34 cjl llaske: not pay for translate in any lang.
19:35 GrannieB that +1 was to llaske
19:35 ElVerma I agree with llaske. The translation is an end to a much larger goal.
19:35 kaametza for example Purpose
19:35 The purpose of the fund is to serve as a source of capital for any interested Sugar Labs member to be able to complete and/or manage one or more Sugar Translation Project.
19:35 Proposed New Motion:
19:35 Requests for funds: will be presented to the Translation's Committe, in writing, with cc to the IAEP mailing list and the Localization maiiling list, at least 72 hours in advance of the monthly scheduled Translation committe meeting.
19:35 walterbender llaske, the bottom line is that Chris has a strong track record regarding both identifying needs for infrastructure and local language development
19:35 GrannieB +1 to llaske again!
19:35 llaske there is few dialect here in France (Breton, Corsica, Catalunya, ...) we could translate Sugar into it but you could be sure that it will not increase the Sugar usage in France
19:35 walterbender kaametza, please let us finish
19:36 samsongoddy_ +1 to llaske
19:36 GrannieB Not the time for new motions. they are supposed to be put in in advance of the meeting
19:36 cjl llaske: no proposal to pay for those L10ns, bu twe should allow them in Pootle.
19:36 walterbender llaske, I don't understand the point you are making
19:36 llaske I'm agree cjl
19:37 walterbender llaske, no one is suggesting we operate without making some investigation of value
19:37 tony376 We have a clearly defined position with a substantial workload. We are fortunate to have an experience person to fill the position. We should get on with it.
19:37 meeting <Jose_Miguel-es> To ask bottoms for translation would have to have a document that base it. Translate in function of an impact expected.
19:37 llaske +1 Jose_Miguel-es
19:37 walterbender tony376, +1
19:37 Claudia_ +1 JoseMiguel
19:37 kaametza Hola Jose Miguel
19:37 CanoeBerry tony376: we need a role desribed in writing, having checkpoints with teeth
19:37 walterbender I
19:38 I'd like to make the following suggestion
19:38 (1) Tony wirte up a succinct description of the role, including feedback about reporting from today's meeting
19:38 (2) he circulate this ASAP and SLOB can vote by email
19:39 kaametza walterbender, +1
19:39 GrannieB Hey board members… why doesn't someone move the motion be "tabled" for the next meeting and meanwhile discuss and refine it for the next meeting… vote on tabling!
19:39 walterbender I don't think we have a proper motion today
19:39 davelab6 llaske: if there is a i18n manager role for a provisional period (say 6 months, so $6k of spending SL funds) then they would be well placed to detail strategy options and execute the better ones
19:39 walterbender or time to finishing in this meeting
19:39 kaametza I do
19:39 <walterbender> I'd like to make the following suggestion
19:39 <walterbender> (1) Tony wirte up a succinct description of the role, including feedback about reporting from today's meeting
19:39 <walterbender> (2) he circulate this ASAP and SLOB can vote by email
19:39 +1 lets continue please
19:39 GrannieB +1 walter
19:39 tony376 OK
19:40 llaske Ok
19:40 walterbender OK
19:40 CanoeBerry +1
19:40 tony376 Walter I meant ok with doing the writeup
19:40 Claudia_ +1
19:40 meeting <Jose_Miguel-es> +1
19:40 GrannieB T-20 min
19:40 walterbender Without the manager role in place, I don't think we can make decisions on the other i18n topics as they are all dependencies
19:40 kaametza GrannieB, please help me with the 3 motions
19:41 I'm asking you beacause you inspired me to continue in this journey when you cocreated the Sugar Translations Committe
19:41 :
19:41 http://pad.publiclab.org/p/SPTF
19:42 walterbender kaametza, we cannot possibly vote on your motion without first resolving the manager role
19:42 Claudia__ <Claudia__!~webchat@rev-18-85-44-69.sugarlabs.org> has joined #sugar-meeting
19:42 GrannieB kaametza, I'm worried about my motion for the Treasurer position which can simplify a lot of these discussions
19:43 walterbender but that said, I don't agree with the proposal to retroactively reallocate the funds I raised to a committee I have no window into.
19:43 It would irresponsible as the project PI
19:43 samsongoddy_ okay
19:43 walterbender I think we need to move on to the next topic
19:44 Quozl` yeah, don't let walter be irresponsible.  ;-)
19:44 kaametza so sha we start the vote
19:44 ?
19:45 Quozl` @chair, is the meeting moving to item 3 of the agenda or item 2.d?
19:45 walterbender kaametza, did you listen to anything I jsut said?
19:45 CanoeBerry T-15 min
19:45 walterbender #topic Sugar Vision
19:45 Claudia_ has quit IRC
19:45 Quozl` @chair, thanks.
19:45 llaske It will be quick
19:45 As I've proposed at the last SLOB meeting, I've worked on a proposal vision for SugarLabs. The idea is to write few lines that we could all share and that we could use to build a strategy and an action plan.
19:46 kaametza walterbender, about retroactivity It sohuld be read on the grant contract
19:46 llaske It's here: https://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/[…]ion_proposal_2016 
19:46 walterbender llaske, can you share this?
19:46 kaametza you asked for those funds to create a seed translation fund
19:46 llaske Shortly it says only 3 things:
19:46 1) Sugar is the best learning platform
19:46 2) Sugar must be accessible by everyone
19:46 3) Sugar must be accessible on any device
19:46 Of course, it's only a first step, if we're agree on this (it's the most important thing!), it's easy to detail an action plan on each point. For example:
19:46 1) What miss in the platform to be the best one ? What content we need to add ?
19:46 2) How we could increase the Sugar community ? How we could deploy Sugar for more users ?
19:46 3) What sort of device we should prioritize ? What about XO support effort ?
19:46 (the last one is the sensitive part :-)
19:46 samsongoddy_ i guess i have to go now, i felt that i have been ignored
19:46 walterbender #link https://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/[…]ion_proposal_2016 
19:47 kaametza on 2013 and it havent been created yet
19:47 ElVerma For what it's worth, I've looked at llaske's document and think that it's a great starting point. This process will have to also rely on our mission statement to come up with a set of defined goals and obejectives.
19:47 cjl samsongoddy_: not ignored, they are just not ready to decide yet
19:48 walterbender llaske, the underlying message is to more formally support Sugarizer :P
19:48 llaske Not really
19:48 The idea is just that the XO is dead
19:48 ElVerma A fair bit of the "how" part will unfold once we have some agreement on goals and objectives.
19:48 llaske so we need to go further
19:48 samsongoddy_ probably it will be suspended to the next meeting right, cjl?
19:48 CanoeBerry samsongoddy_: nigeria is not ignored; thanks for staying up
19:48 walterbender llaske, I am not being critical... I think it is important to look forward
19:48 tony376 I really think we need to be careful re the XO. We have a unique responsibility there.
19:49 kaametza I'm sure there is a good reason, but now it needs to be created Walter even if is not retroactive as from Today the after the motion :d
19:49 llaske My idea is not to stop the work on the XO
19:49 walterbender we have a legacy platform to continue to support
19:49 llaske My idea is to still maintain it but to keep effort elsewhere
19:49 walterbender we have our desktop which we support in Fedora and Debian
19:49 ElVerma Putting on my business school professor hat: Mission + Vision -> Goals -> Objectives -> Tasks. The Tasks part is where most of us are right now...very operational.
19:49 walterbender we have Sugar on a Stick
19:50 llaske Something like 2/3 - 1/3
19:50 walterbender and we have Sugarizer
19:50 Quozl` in my opinion the vision need not mention the legacy platform; work on the legacy platform will continue regardless, because of the active users of that platform.  vision is a longer term thing.
19:50 walterbender that is a lot but I don't see any options to drop at this stage
19:51 IMHO the goal is to reach children regardless of the platform they have access to
19:51 that was in fact part of the initial idea behind creating Sugar Labs
19:51 ElVerma +1 to Quozl
19:51 +1 to walterbender
19:51 GrannieB ElVerma… your hat is just like a good educator's hat! Lionel is right… we do need a refined Mission _+ Vision to get to the Goals
19:51 Quozl` @chair, what is the motion?
19:51 llaske And the XO can't be in the vision, except as the legacy
19:52 CanoeBerry llaske: Small point, but the 1st sentence of your https://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/[…]ion_proposal_2016 is incredibly controversial across most of 2015 (see http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/iaep/ archives).
19:52 ElVerma XO should be in the vision as one of the vehicles
19:52 walterbender llaske, I am happy with the statement as stands
19:52 samsongoddy_ i guess i like the idea too
19:52 davelab6 llaske: the XO is not dead but it is in the process of dying
19:52 llaske XO has no future, as you know all. So we can't put it in our ambition
19:52 davelab6 llaske: i think the question is about how to sunset it gracefully
19:52 samsongoddy_ sure
19:52 llaske +1
19:52 samsongoddy_ that what sugarizer is for
19:52 walterbender llaske, but the sugar desktop is not dead yet
19:52 llaske But our ambition is for 2020. XO will not be here in 2020
19:52 ElVerma I will reiterate: The vehicle of delivery isn't something that should show up in the vision.
19:53 CanoeBerry I disagree.
19:53 icarito if I may say so Sugar Labs already has a vision and a mission statement: to provide a constructionist learning environment to offer children a way to learn to learn (or something something check wiki)
19:53 walterbender it can evolve with the Linux desktop
19:53 samsongoddy_ but xo infinity might
19:53 llaske Every device might
19:53 satellit_e do not forget olpc-ubuntu-sugar-14.04.2
19:53 Quozl` samsongoddy_: the "xo" part of that product has been removed.
19:53 ElVerma icarito: Vison and Mission are two different things
19:53 CanoeBerry The XO will certainly still be an active learning environment in 2020.
19:53 llaske The XO-4 ?
19:53 Claudia__ I agree with ElVerma, "The vehicle of delivery isn't something that should show up in the vision"
19:54 Quozl` CanoeBerry: our next product probably won't have "xo" in the name.
19:54 samsongoddy_ they are good cause in rwanda
19:54 tonyF android phone is v important looking forward, its in the cremotest villages
19:54 GrannieB +1 CanoeBerry… if the battery problem can be solved
19:54 icarito ElVerma, any how good discussion, don't think board meeting material really except perhaps to commit to making a statement by a given time?
19:54 walterbender Quozl`, +1
19:54 ElVerma For the purposes of what needs to happen in the meeting today, I will continue to work with llaske on this.
19:54 walterbender I don't think XO belongs in the vision
19:54 tony376 The point is that a substantial number of XO (mostly XO-1) will be in active use in 2020
19:55 llaske Thanks ElVerma. I guess we've got material here :-)
19:55 Quozl` the three million claim is weak, but that doesn't invalidate a vision, i say let it stand for the moment.
19:55 walterbender tony376, I agree
19:55 ElVerma llaske: Yes, we did :-)
19:55 meeting <Jose_Miguel-es> +1ElVerma.
19:55 icarito also we should really update the XO logo as our central mascot
19:55 samsongoddy_ seems like linux is taking all over the world, have any here the news from microsoft
19:55 Quozl` tony376: yes, i estimate 30,000 of the XO-1 will still be usable in 2020.
19:55 icarito i guess the board would like to discuss that
19:55 walterbender Quozl`, I don't think we need a hard and fast number in the vision statement at all
19:56 kaametza ElVerma +1 vision is a complete mind set, almost a dream of what can be possible, that inspires the momentum of a community
19:56 CanoeBerry Quozl`: could be a lot higher or a lot lower, for sure.
19:56 kaametza to all, sorry If I have been in such a hurry
19:56 Quozl` i thought sugar labs acquired the logo, and we're just using it on the cover of laptops to make a point?  ;-)
19:56 ElVerma Also, for what it's worth, I am doing something similar for another FOSS project that I'm on the board of. There are similarities and differences, but it serves us well if we follow a process.
19:57 Quozl` @chair, i suggest the motion is clear and the discussion near complete.
19:57 icarito i served in this board when it solicited every local lab for vision / mission and 3 6 and 9 month strategic goals
19:57 it sat on it (and substantial funding)
19:57 so clearly some things have to change IMHO
19:57 walterbender llaske, please make your motion so we can vote
19:57 GrannieB It is 4 min to end. Any chance we could consider my Treasurer motion now? Ed and I have to start a 2-1/2 hour drive in the LA traffic and hope to get ahead of the rush hour
19:57 davelab6 icarito: where are the responses to that solicitation?
19:58 llaske I don't want a motion, I'm going to work with ElVerma on another draft that we'll send you on the SLOB mailing list
19:58 GrannieB +1
19:58 icarito davelab6, thanks for the interest I will look for them in the mailing list archive
19:58 walterbender ok.
19:58 meeting <Jose_Miguel-es> +1llaske.
19:58 llaske I would like to open the debate
19:58 Claudia__ thanks, llaske
19:58 llaske It's done
19:58 walterbender #topic proposal for rules of removal and appointment of SLOB members
19:58 CanoeBerry,
19:58 ElVerma llaske: +1
19:59 CanoeBerry Context: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/arc[…]March/017789.html
19:59 walterbender #link http://lists.sugarlabs.org/arc[…]March/017789.html
19:59 CanoeBerry Motion: in keeping with the board 2010's decision on this matter from a different era, I wsuggest that if a Board Member (1) fails to vote and
19:59 attend pre-scheduled Board meetings for more than 12 weeks, (2) resigns or (3) dies, then the Board is empowered and encouraged to appoint a replacement for this seat. Finally, just a clarification that the Replacement Board Member would be required to defend their seat during the very next election.
19:59 walterbender I second
20:00 llaske +1
20:00 walterbender we had a discussion on the list
20:00 CanoeBerry +1
20:00 walterbender +1
20:00 Quozl` it's fine as a motion, i've seen many like it.
20:00 ElVerma +1
20:00 walterbender motion passes....
20:00 meeting <Jose_Miguel-es> +1
20:00 tony376 +1
20:00 CanoeBerry Claudia__: ?
20:00 Claudia__ +1
20:01 CanoeBerry Unanimous, that was easy!
20:01 walterbender I am afraid we are out of time.
20:01 samsongoddy_ yeah
20:01 walterbender GrannieB, I am sorry we did not get to your treasurer motion
20:01 llaske May be few minutes more for GrannieB ?
20:01 walterbender but I don't think we need a new motion to appoint someone
20:01 GrannieB Please!
20:01 walterbender we need to find someone to fill the existing position
20:01 llaske I've got a question on it
20:02 Do we need to give a remuneration to the Treasurer. In OLPC France we've got one (me ! since I left the President position to join SLOB) and we don't have remuneration for the job.
20:02 Plus, as Adam said "SFC is fundamentally being paid to act as SL's treasurer"
20:02 walterbender llaske, I don't think we need to pay anyone for this
20:02 esp. as I think it is a simple reporting task
20:02 Claudia__ walterbender: I agree
20:02 davelab6 +1
20:03 llaske Great. My position in the SLOB is to keep money in the bank :-)
20:03 walterbender I disagree with GrannieB 's second motion about granting the trreasurer unilateral spending ability
20:03 icarito In the past bernie as appointed powers of up to 200 US
20:03 GrannieB The Treasurer would be expected to attend all the meetings. They would liasion with the SFC
20:03 icarito but he refused to use them when requested directly (and publicly)
20:03 llaske So it's the Adam's Job right now :-)
20:03 icarito so requests lingered back to SLOBs
20:03 GrannieB The Treasurer would not spend. They would disburse funds
20:03 walterbender icarito, as I explained in my email that was specific to infrastructure needs, which can be time sensitive
20:03 Claudia__ it would be great for everyone to commit to raise funds to get to more children
20:03 walterbender GrannieB, the SFC does that
20:03 icarito it was not so in the motion that was passed then
20:03 CanoeBerry In other news, I just got access to SFConservancy's bookkeeping system, and this command... ledger -V  -s -S T -d  "T&l<=2" -f sugar.ledger bal\
20:03 '/^(Income|Expenses).*Sugar/' ...yields:
20:03       $ -287,099.18  Income:Sugar
20:03        $ 206,521.59  Expenses:Sugar
20:03 --------------------
20:03        $ -80,577.59
20:04 icarito if my memory serves me correctly
20:04 walterbender icarito, there was no motion voted on
20:04 icarito yes there was, will look for that too for you
20:04 CanoeBerry So I believe we have $80,577.59 in our account as of March 31, 2016 -- though audit/adjustments are still forthcoming if I understand Bradley Kuhn correctly.
20:04 GrannieB small amounts for little things… a banner, paper clips etc would not need board approval. Everything else would
20:04 walterbender icarito, I thought you were referring to the present discussion
20:05 icarito, there was a motion to grant bernie this spending discression for infratsructure
20:05 icarito well no I was referring to the past appointment of that role to bernie in maybe 2009
20:05 it did not specify infrastructure
20:05 perhaps you had it implied among you
20:05 GrannieB Motions for funds to be expended would be presented  to the treasurer who would, in turn present them to tbe board
20:05 icarito but I voted on a general motion
20:05 walterbender icarito, whether or not the motion said that, that was the intent
20:05 satellit_e FYI I donated for a Hard Drive to bernie then
20:05 walterbender GrannieB, I disagree
20:06 icarito that's why we requested him to approve 150 funds in 2010 and had to wait ~3 months for slobs approva
20:06 GrannieB this would cut down on a lot of the cross-talk at meetings and things would move more smoothly
20:06 walterbender I think we do that for specific teams needs
20:06 not a general position
20:06 icarito yes GrannieB i believe so too
20:06 GrannieB too many people talking at a time
20:06 slows things down
20:06 walterbender GrannieB, I'd like to see some evidence
20:06 Quozl` GrannieB: no, not too many people talking; but rather too few listening.
20:06 GrannieB wastes time  at meetings
20:06 walterbender GrannieB, the slowing down is people trying to talk off topic
20:06 icarito you can look as an example of inaction the past 3 years
20:07 walterbender icarito, enough with your innuendos
20:07 GrannieB Hey Walter… just look at the last 2 meetings… all about $$$ and everyone talking about something different at the same time
20:07 icarito walterbender, about that could you please share the meeting rules?
20:07 i understand there is a protocol but can't find a reference to it
20:07 GrannieB I just want to see Sugar Labs work smoothly like most organizations in the world
20:07 walterbender GrannieB, nothing in the past two meetings has anything to do with a few hundred dollars of desicretionatry spending
20:07 samsongoddy_ me too
20:07 icarito i find distasteful how you address each other but I think that is within rules
20:07 GrannieB not like this kindergarten… sorry MIT folks!
20:07 icarito i just dont know
20:08 walterbender GrannieB, I don't what MIT folks you are referring to but I suggest you read the logs
20:08 look. I need to go
20:08 ElVerma I have to leave for another meeting. Until next time! Oh, and I think we should rebase Sugar on Windows10. With a GNU Hurd kernel ;-)
20:08 icarito walterbender, you are not entitled to mistreat people whoever you are, I'm sorry
20:09 cjl cough
20:09 llaske :-) ElVerma
20:09 walterbender thanks all... to be continued
20:09 Quozl` icarito: agreed there are ambiguous interpersonal behavioural standards on irc.
20:09 walterbender tony376, will send email
20:09 GrannieB "Lifelong Kindergarten" which is great for everything but meetings!
20:09 tony376 thanks
20:09 walterbender #endmeeting
20:09 meeting Meeting ended Fri Apr  1 20:09:35 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. (v 0.1.4)
20:09 Minutes: http://meeting.sugarlabs.org/s[…]-01T19:01:31.html
20:09 Log:     http://meeting.sugarlabs.org/s[…]16-04-01T19:01:31
20:09 CanoeBerry Breathe...
20:09 tony376 has quit IRC
20:09 llaske Waooo
20:10 meeting <Jose_Miguel-es> *Bye
20:10 ElVerma has left #sugar-meeting
20:10 llaske Bye !
20:10 meeting * Jose_Miguel has quit (Quit: Page closed)
20:10 ricowill has quit IRC
20:11 tonyF thanks all, bye
20:11 Claudia__ bye
20:12 walterbender bye
20:13 kaametza Claudia__, you may consider seconding my proposals for the sake of our indigenous comminuties of users :D
20:13 samsongoddy_ bye!
20:13 llaske oops could someone confirm me date/time for the next meeting
20:13 kaametza t can be done by email... right?
20:13 GrannieB has quit IRC
20:13 kaametza Claudia__,?
20:13 JM__ has quit IRC
20:14 walterbender llaske, the first friday of very month at 19UTC
20:15 llaske ok thanks
20:17 kaametza llaske, however I would like to hear more from you about the SL vision
20:18 samsongoddy_ i guess my proposal will be voted via email
20:18 llaske Sure. It was just a first draft to share main principe
20:18 kaametza I belive Sugar has the capacity to become a facilitador for knowledge exchange among continents
20:18 llaske Nice slogan !
20:19 Claudia__ has quit IRC
20:19 kaametza :D i like slogans, have some marketing background
20:19 samsongoddy_ have you seen my proposal, llaske?
20:19 llaske Quickly. Could you give the URL again
20:19 samsongoddy_ okay
20:20 kaametza samsongoddy_, have you published anywhere yet?
20:21 samsongoddy_ i will just share the doc
20:21 llaske okay
20:21 samsongoddy_ https://onedrive.live.com/redi[…]thint=file%2cdocx
20:22 here is the first one then the other was mailed my laura
20:22 you can mail me your feedback
20:23 llaske just reading it
20:23 samsongoddy_ i have to go now, my time is up. I have to take my medicine
20:23 kaametza samsongoddy_, you should send it to the Translation Committe with cc to SLOBS
20:24 llaske, that is not the proosal
20:24 icarito samsongoddy_, that looks like a contract not a proposal i think there was a spreadsheet
20:24 kaametza that is the contract template from conservancy
20:24 llaske yes, right it's more a contract
20:24 samsongoddy_ the exibit A listed the projects
20:25 the milestone fee was added, i guess i have to send it to slobs for voting
20:25 llaske Okay. I see
20:25 kaametza samsongoddy_, you need to publish all documents...
20:25 llaske But you know my strategy: what is the motivation to translate in Igbo, Hausa, Yoruba, Fulani ?
20:25 kaametza not sure where would be the best place
20:26 llaske Is there any deployment there ?
20:26 How many people already use Sugar in Nigeria ?
20:27 icarito llaske since you bring that up I understand your point but I think it's too narrow a metric to look only at sugar adoption
20:27 kaametza llaske, samsongoddy_ is from the Yoruba tribe, one of many using sugar in english
20:27 icarito our mission is broader than that
20:28 llaske, I volunteer for Sugar Labs because I believe in spreading freedom
20:28 so there is value in sitting down with communities and having them improve their software
20:28 learn that they can give value to their culture thru technologic appropriation
20:28 I'm not sure how to cuantify that
20:28 llaske yes but unfortunately we can't pay to translate Sugar in every existing language
20:28 kaametza learning english/french/spanish with the computer is good, pacially for developing computacional skils
20:29 icarito llaske, perhaps we even could if we improve our workflow and remove bottlenecks
20:29 samsongoddy_ has quit IRC
20:29 icarito languages are human heritage that needs urgent action IMHO
20:29 kaametza still, learning in their own languages has a secret value
20:30 it makes children proud of who they are
20:30 of their traditions, their granparents..
20:30 icarito if we need to focus on curriculum we might as well teach ofimatics
20:31 kaametza the mere fact of been able to translate some software is an amazing idea that opens many windows for the learners minds
20:32 llaske, I have to get back to the children, hope to talk to you soon
20:35 icarito just read from Simple English wikipedia what innuendo is: An innuendo is an indirect or implied statement of ideas or opinions. - I don't think there was anything indirect or implied in my opinions.
20:36 and i try to avoid by all means to be sarcastic
20:36 I think it's a nasty custom
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