Time |
Nick |
Message |
15:02 |
sdziallas |
#chair mchua pbrobinson sdziallas |
15:02 |
|
#topic Sugar on a Stick Weekly Meeting (2010/06/21) |
15:03 |
|
We're still waiting for folks to drop in, just letting meetbot gear up already. |
15:05 |
pbrobinson |
really is here! |
15:05 |
sdziallas |
hi JT4sugar! |
15:05 |
|
and hi pbrobinson! |
15:05 |
JT4sugar |
Hello |
15:05 |
sdziallas |
#link http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/S[…]k_meetings#Agenda |
15:05 |
pbrobinson |
waves to all |
15:06 |
sdziallas |
(which isn't overly shiny this time, but we'll live with that) |
15:07 |
mchua |
here |
15:07 |
sdziallas |
hey mchua! |
15:07 |
pbrobinson |
#info Sugar 0.90 has been accepted as an upstream Fedora 14 feature https://fedoraproject.org/wiki[…]atures/Sugar_0.90 |
15:07 |
sdziallas |
Looks like we have a crowd. Awesome! Diving into this now. |
15:08 |
|
pbrobinson: whoa, awesome! thanks for taking care of that :) |
15:08 |
|
#note pbrobinson rockz |
15:08 |
|
#topic Revised Browse Default Page Feature |
15:09 |
pbrobinson |
I think mchua has been dealing with this |
15:09 |
mchua |
We have 2 in our queue today for review |
15:09 |
|
#link http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/S[…]mitted_for_review |
15:10 |
satellit__ |
http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/F[…]lt-bookmarks.html |
15:10 |
mchua |
#link http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/F[…]lt-bookmarks.html |
15:10 |
sdziallas |
#note mchua rockz too (thanks for overhauling that wiki page) |
15:10 |
mchua |
So this is the first of 3 we have to review today. |
15:11 |
sdziallas |
nods. |
15:11 |
mchua |
Looking at the proposal, it's got more things as satellit__ has been incorporating feedback, but still needs a lot of cleanup work... we need one clear path to testing |
15:11 |
|
which is why I've been encouraging satellit__ to get his bookmarks.html somewhere public/permanent, like gitorious, so the steps are reproducible. |
15:12 |
|
imo, this one is not yet ready, but I would be willing to sit down with satellit__ at some point between now and the next meeting and finish it. |
15:12 |
pbrobinson |
so do we mention that this is still incomplete and delay a decision again? |
15:12 |
mchua |
Yes. |
15:12 |
sdziallas |
+1 |
15:12 |
mchua |
satellit__: what you should do is get your change in as a patch in git, so the feature can be pulled in and tested. |
15:13 |
|
satellit__: er, "what you should do next," that is. |
15:13 |
|
imo. |
15:13 |
sdziallas |
mchua: possibly even into browse -- lucian said he'd be happy to answer questions, too. |
15:13 |
pbrobinson |
mchua: agreed |
15:13 |
mchua |
sdziallas: Yep, exactly. Upstream when possible. |
15:13 |
|
#Browse proposal not testable yet; encouraged to resubmit next week - please submit as a patch to upstream Browse. |
15:13 |
sdziallas |
alright, let's note that then. can haz +1s? |
15:14 |
|
mchua: mind making that an #action/#agreed? :) |
15:14 |
mchua |
erp. that would be my suggestion for the #info. |
15:14 |
|
+1. |
15:14 |
|
#agreed Browse proposal does not pass this round, not testable yet; encouraged to resubmit next week - please submit as a patch to upstream Browse. |
15:14 |
satellit_Acer |
ok but I thought feature could be prototype until approval. |
15:15 |
mchua |
satellit_Acer: We still need a specific route to its implementation - right now there are lots of options for implementation and we haven't picked/tested them reproducibly yet. |
15:15 |
satellit_Acer |
mucha let me know when...: ) we can meet |
15:15 |
mchua |
satellit_Acer: After Wednesday this week, just about anytime you find me online. |
15:15 |
satellit_Acer |
what will determine what it links to? |
15:15 |
mchua |
sdziallas: Next? |
15:15 |
satellit_Acer |
ok |
15:15 |
pbrobinson |
satellit_Acer: in can in that the feature doesn't need to be complete like 0.90 but what's being proposed for the feature yet is not yet complete so we can't vote on that yet |
15:15 |
sdziallas |
mchua: want more features first? |
15:16 |
mchua |
sdziallas: right, the other two. |
15:16 |
satellit__ |
http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/T[…]Soas-v3_Mirabelle |
15:16 |
sdziallas |
#http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/F[…]n_Kit_DVD#Summary |
15:16 |
|
Argh. |
15:16 |
|
#topic Sugar Creation Kit DVD Feature |
15:16 |
|
#link http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/F[…]n_Kit_DVD#Summary |
15:17 |
mchua |
I thought we rejected this as a feature because it was too big. |
15:17 |
pbrobinson |
+1 |
15:17 |
sdziallas |
Yup, right. That's my opinion, too. |
15:17 |
mchua |
Or rather, that the SCK is actually a superset of SoaS, and is a separate project. |
15:18 |
sdziallas |
pbrobinson: I think you want -1? |
15:18 |
|
pbrobinson: depending on the point of view, that is. ;) |
15:18 |
satellit_Acer |
I did not expect review here today |
15:18 |
pbrobinson |
sdziallas: +1 to the fact it was rejected. -1 to the vote for it |
15:18 |
mchua |
satellit_Acer: Does that make sense? This isn't a "revise and resubmit, please" - but a "we think this is inherently a separate project" decision. |
15:19 |
pbrobinson |
it contains SoaS. By definition SoaS can't contain itselft! |
15:19 |
|
itself! |
15:19 |
sdziallas |
pbrobinson: Egg! Chicken! Egg!!! |
15:19 |
satellit_Acer |
do I try for Project status instead in sugarlabs? |
15:19 |
mchua |
satellit_Acer: That is one option. |
15:19 |
pbrobinson |
satellit_Acer: no idea |
15:19 |
mchua |
doesn't know either, though. |
15:19 |
satellit_Acer |
I will maintain it (with help I hope) |
15:20 |
mchua |
satellit_Acer: I see SCK as something SoaS could potentially work with, but it's definitely a separate project. |
15:20 |
sdziallas |
mchua: I agree with that. |
15:20 |
pbrobinson |
satellit_Acer: as I suggested I think you should break it down into smaller features. Some things would be worthwhile to get into SoaS itself. |
15:20 |
mchua |
satellit_Acer: well, it's your project :) so you should take it, run with it, build a community around it. |
15:20 |
sdziallas |
pbrobinson: +1 |
15:20 |
mchua |
anyhow, the decision is a "no, not a SoaS feature - separate project, take elsewhere", aiui. |
15:21 |
|
Shall we move on? The last one will be quick. |
15:21 |
|
sdziallas: pbrobinson: that is, if I get a +1 on that decision. ;) |
15:21 |
sdziallas |
mchua: you do. +1. |
15:21 |
satellit_Acer |
pbrobinson the link in revised bookmarks should have met your objections to DVD |
15:21 |
pbrobinson |
+1 / -1 |
15:21 |
sdziallas |
pbrobinson: :) |
15:22 |
mchua |
#agreed Sugar Creation Kit feature proposal decision is a "no, not a SoaS feature - separate project, take elsewhere" |
15:22 |
satellit_Acer |
ok |
15:22 |
mchua |
#topic ASLOxo feature proposal |
15:22 |
|
This needs no vote; it's not a feature proposal yet (there's no proposal, the link is directly to a tarred file). |
15:22 |
pbrobinson |
satellit_Acer: the revised bookmarks idea does meet my objections, when the feature is complete. Once its complete I am but one person that needs to agree its worthwhile |
15:23 |
mchua |
#info Not a feature proposal yet (there's no proposal, the link is directly to a tarred file). |
15:23 |
|
#info Please follow the procedure, http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/S[…]for_consideration, and submit for consideration when the proposal is complete. |
15:23 |
|
sdziallas: next topic! |
15:23 |
satellit_Acer |
ok I can package it in CD ot dvd format easily from links it contains |
15:24 |
mchua |
clears the features-to-review queue from the wiki page, now refreshed for next week |
15:24 |
sdziallas |
mchua: awesome, thanks! |
15:24 |
|
mchua: next up should be the test cycle? |
15:24 |
|
#topic Dev Test Release Cycle |
15:24 |
|
I think we can safely defer this by a week. |
15:25 |
|
satellit_Acer: has put comments on the wiki page -- maybe this could be incorporated in something like test plans or so? |
15:25 |
mchua |
My apologies for being behind on that action item. I'll do it right after this meeting; it's pretty quick. |
15:25 |
satellit__ |
I added it to http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/0[…]ent_Testing_image |
15:25 |
mchua |
has been rather hosed the past 2 weeks |
15:26 |
sdziallas |
#action dev test cycle deferred by a week |
15:26 |
mchua |
#action mchua to start dev/test cycle this week |
15:27 |
sdziallas |
next? |
15:28 |
|
looks around, wonders if that's a yes. |
15:28 |
|
pbrobinson: did you hear from mtd? |
15:29 |
pbrobinson |
sdziallas: hasn't had time to chase as I've been travelling constantly |
15:29 |
sdziallas |
pbrobinson: yup, I bet :) that's more than fair |
15:30 |
pbrobinson |
so can we delay that to next week |
15:30 |
sdziallas |
#topic post processing script topic (mtd) |
15:30 |
|
#action deferred to next week too (we'll revisit) |
15:30 |
mtd |
what's up? |
15:30 |
sdziallas |
#topic what people plan to work on for the v4 cycle |
15:30 |
mtd |
ignore me |
15:30 |
sdziallas |
mtd: you were on the agenda :) (naw, it's... okay, well.) |
15:31 |
mchua |
actually, I'd like to have the mtd pbrobinson discussion now. |
15:31 |
pbrobinson |
mchua: sure |
15:31 |
sdziallas |
#topic post processing scripts (mtd) |
15:31 |
mchua |
and let's see if we can conclude that in the next 30m, then I'll say it's a meeting well-spent. :) |
15:32 |
sdziallas |
here we go! (I think we can move the "what we're going to work on" to later / next week, too) |
15:32 |
|
mchua: totally agreed. |
15:32 |
mchua |
sdziallas: actually, we can move the "v4 plans" to list for now... I'll bring it up again when we have several sample plans to actually look at. |
15:32 |
sdziallas |
#action move v4 work plans to list |
15:32 |
|
mchua: yup, sounds good :) |
15:32 |
mchua |
We're still very much getting our bearings with this whole idea of regular meetings + action items + processes here. |
15:33 |
pbrobinson |
mtd: can you cover what you want to do in the post processing scripts in the .ks |
15:33 |
mchua |
And the scale will tip a bit too far in the "whee, procedure!" direction as we get started, but hopefully it'll balance out shortly. |
15:33 |
|
shuts up and listens |
15:34 |
mtd |
pbrobinson: ok. For background, though, I was just summarising what I thought was a sensible next-step for the "More robust .iso" feature, and because I was the last person to speak, got tagged as having raised the agenda item :). |
15:34 |
|
pbrobinson: the idea here is that "more robust iso" feature is basically "SoaS shuold ship as a pre-partitioned disk image with ext3 rootfs". |
15:34 |
|
as I understand it |
15:35 |
|
stop me, anyone, if that's wrong |
15:35 |
sdziallas |
mtd: that's what I understood, too. |
15:35 |
mtd |
pbrobinson: so |
15:35 |
|
pbrobinson: I think that goal is achievable with a bit of scripting that takes the livecd-tools .iso image we get now... |
15:35 |
|
pbrobinson: and: |
15:36 |
|
1) creates a pre-partitioned disk image (cue loads of partition / cylinder /etc. nuances here) |
15:36 |
|
2) unrolls the livecd-tools' nested filesystems and copies the contents to the disk image from #1 |
15:36 |
|
and |
15:36 |
pbrobinson |
mtd: ok, we're working a couple of options for that outside of SoaS as well with the hope of letting someone else deal with 1) |
15:37 |
satellit_Acer |
can it expand ext3 to fit USB? |
15:37 |
mtd |
3) does any hacking of the filesystem contents necessary to remove any undesirable assumptions about the livecd-tools' filesystem configuration. |
15:37 |
|
satellit__: yes |
15:37 |
|
pbrobinson: so... |
15:37 |
satellit_Acer |
+1 |
15:37 |
pbrobinson |
mtd: so hopefully liveusb or livecd creator can deal with that by SoaS-4 |
15:38 |
mtd |
pbrobinson: #1? cool |
15:38 |
|
pbrobinson: so my idea was that the blueberry SoaS branch had scripts to do 1-3 that I had made for the XO-1 builds... |
15:38 |
sdziallas |
mtd: :) |
15:38 |
mtd |
pbrobinson: ...and that they could be trivially adapted to run on the .iso spin-output and create said build. |
15:38 |
|
pbrobinson: the one other advantage of doing it this way... |
15:39 |
pbrobinson |
mtd: do you have any of the details of what the blueberry scripts did documented at all? |
15:39 |
mtd |
pbrobinson: ...besides the whole "we're still a spin and use Fedora infrastructure to do it"... |
15:39 |
|
pbrobinson: (coming) |
15:39 |
pbrobinson |
mtd: i think we need more than a one prong approach to this so very interested |
15:40 |
mtd |
pbrobinson: ...is that we still have the livecd-tools .isos, are completely in tune with any features it provides, and can still have an image suitable for using from read-only media. |
15:40 |
sdziallas |
mtd: (basically, if I get you correctly, you're proposing to roll the stuff from the buildscripts back then $upstream?) |
15:40 |
|
grins. |
15:40 |
mtd |
sdziallas: yes, insofar as upstream, which is focused on creating a livecd - read-only-root - image, will accept. |
15:41 |
|
pbrobinson: sure, I'm just, recall, summarising a useful approach that I see. |
15:41 |
sdziallas |
mtd: I think I like that plan. :) (from what I heard) |
15:41 |
mtd |
pbrobinson: so I think that summarise it, happy to discuss the other prongs, clarifications, etc. |
15:41 |
sdziallas |
I'm +1 to pbrobinson exploring approaches here. |
15:41 |
mtd |
s/summarise/summarises/ |
15:42 |
sdziallas |
pbrobinson: I'm not meaning that you *should* explore approaches but that I'm +1 to what you said. :) |
15:42 |
pbrobinson |
mtd: sounds great. I'm hoping to get an option added to liveusb-creator to do something other than overlay in that tool. mchua is facilitating that this week with a face 2 face + icecream |
15:42 |
mtd |
pbrobinson: the blueberry scripts's documentation is, at a high level, what I've just said, but of course as they get more mature / critiqued / relevant, additional documentation could be written (I swear I've tried to explain it plenty of times, so maybe I'm not the best person to try again :)) |
15:42 |
mchua |
Indeed. I brought lmacken up to speed as best I could last week and he promised us face time this week to, essentially, dump everything he had to push on us, update us, and then leave the path clear for us to do stuff henceforth. |
15:43 |
|
basically is unblocking us on lmacken. |
15:43 |
mtd |
pbrobinson: cool, sounds like an eminently sensible approad. |
15:43 |
|
ch. |
15:43 |
mchua |
mtd: I'm happy to take a crack at that documentation, just point me at the stuff that needs to be explainified more. |
15:43 |
pbrobinson |
mtd: we catch up for coffee next week or when I pick up the other stuff. |
15:43 |
mtd |
mchua: well, basically, what I said in 1), 2), and 3) above, I think. |
15:44 |
|
pbrobinson: sounds good. |
15:44 |
satellit_Acer |
can we also resume distribution of vbox appliances on /soas/appliances for v4? |
15:45 |
mtd |
satellit__: in the past that was all downstream of the unrolled-livecd-iso process, so no reason why it couldn't be done again, I guess, except tfor the disk space and download bandwidth it consumed. |
15:45 |
pbrobinson |
satellit_Acer: I don't plan to because you can boot the ISO and then install it to _ANY_ virtual options including all the others |
15:46 |
mtd |
satellit__: so the people that a) coded that creation; b) provided the disk space; and c) paid for the bandwidth would have to decide :) |
15:46 |
satellit_Acer |
I have been making them and loading to Tgillard |
15:47 |
mtd |
satellit_Acer: sounds like the people that agitate for b) and c) have just spoken. Someone like yourself or SL could take over. |
15:47 |
mchua |
mtd: ok, I dumped it in http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/M[…]ailed_Description so I'll see it when I take my next pass through. I'll bring this up with pbrobinson and lmacken when they talk this week; my goal for that ice-cream fest is to finish this feature proposal so we understand the direction + scope-of-work there. |
15:47 |
satellit_Acer |
ovf for import like USR |
15:47 |
pbrobinson |
satellit_Acer: stop using the me thing. its annoying! |
15:47 |
mtd |
mchua: sounds good. |
15:47 |
satellit_Acer |
ok |
15:47 |
|
new toy |
15:49 |
sdziallas |
Alright, can we get a motion for this? |
15:49 |
|
Or an #action? |
15:49 |
pbrobinson |
satellit_Acer: so if we do VBox what about qemu, kvm, vmware, xen, and other images? The reason for not doing them all is because they all support booting a VM using an .iso image so its a lot less QA and engineering as well as hosting and bandwidth |
15:49 |
satellit_Acer |
ok |
15:49 |
mtd |
sdziallas: I think the action is what mchua said |
15:49 |
|
sdziallas: err, she indicated two actions, I guess |
15:50 |
sdziallas |
#action what mchua said above :) |
15:50 |
mtd |
sdziallas: #action further iteration on http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/M[…]ailed_Description |
15:50 |
mchua |
#action mchua, pbrobinson, and lmacken to meet and finish http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/M[…]ailed_Description so we understand the direction + scope-of-work before our next meeting. |
15:50 |
|
#action mchua, pbrobinson, and lmacken to finish a Pru Frappe. |
15:50 |
|
:D |
15:50 |
mtd |
sdziallas: #action mchua to facilitate ice-cream fest to finalise http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/More_robust_iso feature proposal |
15:50 |
sdziallas |
mtd: yeah, that works too :) |
15:50 |
mtd |
dammit, she types fast |
15:50 |
mchua |
Indeed I do. |
15:51 |
|
Anyhow, I think this is good - looks like we have a heads-down week coming up, lots of work to do. |
15:51 |
sdziallas |
Alrighty. |
15:51 |
|
Anything else? |
15:52 |
mchua |
#topic dev/test/release process |
15:52 |
pbrobinson |
mtd: mtd and pbrobinson to meet as a follow up to other meeting to sync up mtd and cover blueberry scripts |
15:52 |
mchua |
#link http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/S[…]s#Testing_process |
15:52 |
pbrobinson |
bah |
15:52 |
mchua |
#action mtd and pbrobinson to meet as a follow up to other meeting to sync up mtd and cover blueberry scripts |
15:52 |
pbrobinson |
#action mtd and pbrobinson to meet as a follow up to other meeting to sync up mtd and cover blueberry scripts |
15:52 |
|
LOL |
15:52 |
|
mchua: thanks! |
15:53 |
mchua |
And *now* I think we're done. |
15:53 |
sdziallas |
Perfect! |
15:53 |
mchua |
or at least I have no other business. |
15:53 |
sdziallas |
hasn't, either. |
15:53 |
mchua |
It may seem like a lot of meeting overhead, but this is the first time we've really done central, public communication on a regular basis about SoaS. |
15:53 |
|
So... we're getting there. Yay, running as a more and more sustainable project with regular engineering (and soon, QA)! |
15:54 |
sdziallas |
Yes, I'm really happy with this happening! |
15:54 |
satellit_Acer |
make spread sheet on wiki? |
15:56 |
sdziallas |
#endmeeting |