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#sugar-meeting, 2010-06-01

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Time Nick Message
10:10 SeanDaly #topic Mirabelle media launch
10:11 following up on our last marketing meeting & yesterday's SoaS meeting I think a media campaign about Mirabelle and the SpaS team for LinuxTag will work
10:11 s/Spas/Soas
10:12 erikos listens
10:12 SeanDaly As I think erikos pointed out linuxtag was SoaS's first media campaign a year ago
10:12 erikos SeanDaly: that is right
10:13 SeanDaly Due to a number of circumstances Mirabelle can't have the same e-book focus we had in December
10:14 So this time I think a focus on the team will work
10:14 Recruitment needs to be a priority, we are too lean
10:15 We've arranged with olpcnews for sdz to do a guest post
10:15 about Mirabelle and the team
10:15 erikos SeanDaly: sounds great
10:15 sdziallas nods. (which is awesome, btw!)
10:16 SeanDaly: thanks for that; I'm still writing it but I'll have it done soon.
10:16 SeanDaly sdziallas: we can time this to appear the day before the press release
10:16 (date we should pick now)
10:16 sdziallas SeanDaly: I think that'd make sense, yup! +1
10:16 erikos SeanDaly: as Fedora is not present at this year's Linuxtag, maybe we can get the people that would normally go toFedora... :)
10:17 SeanDaly by the way, this is a classic technique for generating positive coverage; you may remember Walter did a piece on teleread.org for Blueberry, and a piece on Groklaw for I think the joint FSF PR
10:17 erikos: ah I didn't know that
10:18 erikos: you'll be distributing balloons ;-)
10:18 erikos SeanDaly: of course
10:19 SeanDaly: http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/M[…]Tag2010#Equipment
10:19 SeanDaly: these are the current numbers of the merchandise we have
10:19 SeanDaly: maybe we should get more...
10:19 SeanDaly sdziallas: I won't guide you about what to write, you write well. My only advice would be to focus on how the change to spin status solves the sustainability problem and we need more team members ;-)
10:20 erikos: maybe some more flyers?
10:20 sdziallas SeanDaly: thank you! yeah, I think I'll put some strong statements in that what you're doing is not something you do easily or something... you're right :)
10:21 walterbender there is the recent on-line availability of the linux-magazine-es article we may use, perhaps?
10:21 JT4sugar Focus on stability, customization, localization-call out for building local teams-this allows for empowerment at local level
10:21 erikos SeanDaly: I don't think we are short on flyers, we did not hand out more last time
10:21 SeanDaly satellit_: ping?
10:21 satellit_ listening
10:21 SeanDaly erikos: oh OK
10:21 JT4sugar erikos, If you are looking to give out something Mirabelle SoaS Creation Kit DVD may be way to go
10:22 SeanDaly satellit_: I think we should promote the SoaS Creation Kit in our PR
10:22 erikos JT4sugar: SeanDaly yeah, good point
10:22 SeanDaly hee hee minds in phase not like that every day :D
10:22 satellit_ +1 even though it is not a approved "feature"?
10:23 erikos SeanDaly: we will try to sell usb-sticks
10:23 SeanDaly erikos: great
10:24 erikos SeanDaly: we ordered 10 and we will see how it goes for the future
10:24 SeanDaly: if there is potential, we can do more then
10:24 satellit_ * any way to make some with liveinst or zyx-liveinstaller as ext4?  Much more robust
10:24 SeanDaly satellit_, JT4sugar forgive my ignorance but did Mike Lee help us after all with DVD sleeve artwork?
10:24 JT4sugar satellit_, Does that mean Feature for SL? Or is that a Fedora thing?
10:25 satellit_ fedora...
10:25 SeanDaly I ask because I could arrange to have a small run of DVDs burned to send to erikos
10:25 satellit_ * are there any changes in DVD I should do before?
10:25 JT4sugar SeanDaly, Yes he supplied artwork for CD-Sugar Demo and DVD-Sugar on a Stick Creation Kit
10:26 SeanDaly is that on the wiki? I remember seeing something
10:27 satellit_:  think you've been numbering your DVD versions do you foresee more changes coming?
10:27 satellit_ only if requested....
10:28 SeanDaly satellit_: I ask before I have 20 or 40 duplicated ;-)
10:28 satellit_ *09 is Mirabelle but has older strawberry and blueberry on directory
10:28 SeanDaly sdziallas: remnd me please the date of your talk at LinuxTag?
10:28 JT4sugar satellit_, The version I believe we gave out at Computers and Writing conference was 7.0 I think you are now at 9.0. I need to download and look
10:28 sdziallas SeanDaly: It's June 11!
10:29 SeanDaly satellit_: it's great to have previous images on there
10:29 sdziallas: morning or afternoon? sorry I forgot
10:29 sdziallas SeanDaly: morning! 10.30 until 11 or something.
10:29 (yup, that's it)
10:29 #link http://www.linuxtag.org/2010/e[…]s.html?talkid=382
10:30 JT4sugar satellit_, Want to see that we have enough guidance included for the not so technical
10:30 SeanDaly sdziallas: OK the reason  ask is, we want to create an event with buzz and the question is do we have the PR released the very day of yor talk, or prior
10:30 my instinct is prior, to leverage opening day of LinuxTag which I think is the 9th
10:31 JT4sugar SeanDaly, My suggestion is prior so SDZ talk is standing room only
10:31 satellit_ * Basically wiki/ and ASLO plus .iso's and foss manuals
10:31 sdziallas SeanDaly: I'd argue prior makes sense, too. (since it might attract more people to LinuxTag, too)
10:32 SeanDaly How about the 9th? that way we can dateline from LinuxTag and point to sdz talk 2 days later
10:33 sdziallas that sounds good!
10:33 so the olpcnews article would have to go out by June 8, right?
10:34 erikos SeanDaly: 9th sounds good to me
10:34 SeanDaly sdziallas: yes that would be the idea; and mention in there how "lucky" visitors to LinuxTag can pick up Mirabelle and SoaS Creation Kit and meet SL contributors
10:34 sdziallas SeanDaly: okeydokey, can do that!
10:35 SeanDaly sdziallas: I'll ask Wayan, but just so you know it's often the case that editors can't accomodate. With advance notice should be OK though.
10:35 sdziallas SeanDaly: okay, cool! (I can get it done by June 7th or 6th or so, too)
10:36 satellit_ * please review 09 DVD and see it has what you need on it..... ( there is time to change it if needed)
10:36 SeanDaly satellit_: is SoaS-CK available by torrent too, or direct download only? it's b i g
10:37 satellit_ no torrent. do not know how to set it up  only from sunjammer Tgillard
10:37 SeanDaly sdziallas: the 6th would be ideal so Wayan has time to look it over
10:37 satellit_ * about 2 hr DL at HS cable
10:37 sdziallas SeanDaly: alright, we can go for that.
10:37 SeanDaly I've been struggling these past months with no ADSL at home :-( long story
10:38 satellit_ I can mail a DVD of .iso if needed
10:38 JT4sugar sdziallas, When talking about Creation Kit I think we want to seed idea that it allows you to copy files to your machine and begin to create Sugar on a Stick and  then allows you to pass DVD onto colleague and so on "Sugar Baton Program"
10:38 SeanDaly satellit_: is DVD artwork a PDF? same download location?
10:39 hee hee "share your ice cream"
10:39 satellit_ I do not know of artwork
10:39 SeanDaly satellit_: will try to download overnight
10:40 satellit_ ok  Let me know DVD is small to mail
10:40 *Bend Oregon
10:40 SeanDaly satellit_: snailmail will take time I'm afraid I'm in Paris
10:40 JT4sugar I will email artwork its in EPS and PDF
10:40 sdziallas JT4sugar: *nod*
10:41 SeanDaly OK let's talk about the visual for a moment OK?
10:41 I mean te one which will accompany the PR and is often reproduced in news websites & blogs
10:41 JT4sugar Just sent artwork to Sean, satelit, SDZ
10:42 SeanDaly we can use the updated-color-combo beauty shot with the four sticks
10:42 upside: branding is strong and color change is fresh
10:42 downside: same-old, same-old
10:43 alternatives: beauty shot with SoaS Mirabelle logo of DVD + stick;
10:43 satellit_ *artwork here
10:43 SeanDaly or a netbook with stick?
10:44 Somewhere I have the alternate beauty shots my friend Philippe did at the time. The 4 sticks was the best one, but there were a couple others - I will look for those
10:45 yet another alternative: one or more team members holding stick, or netbook?
10:45 focus on team...
10:45 what do you think?
10:47 looking at artwork...
10:48 erikos SeanDaly: artwork, hmmm ;p
10:48 SeanDaly: I liked the picture of the tree that Sebastian used
10:49 SeanDaly artwork is great but I wonder if we can tweak if necessary, DVD logo instead of CD logo for example
10:49 erikos: which tree was that?
10:50 erikos a mirabelle one
10:50 SeanDaly oh on the blog post...
10:51 sdziallas got that from flickr - it's under a Creative Commons license! :)
10:51 JT4sugar Walter in his presentation at Computers & Writing had a slide of table full of different netbooks with SoaS it might work
10:51 erikos sdziallas: perfect ;p
10:51 JT4sugar SeanDaly, Tweak? DVD vs CD?
10:52 sdziallas #link http://sdziallas.com/blog/seba[…]ey-are-there.html
10:52 SeanDaly JT4sugar: yes look at DVD artwork logo is says CD... better to say DVD
10:52 sdziallas #link http://www.flickr.com/photos/d[…]ian17/4609948479/
10:52 JT4sugar Gotcha
10:52 sdziallas uh, actually no. it's a wrong link.
10:53 SeanDaly JT4sugar: also better to have Mirabelle clors instead of Strawberry colors
10:54 JT4sugar SeanDaly, Is that easy change for you to make with files I sent you?
10:55 SeanDaly JT4sugar: EPS file: not sure, I installed Inkscape and bouht a book but am not a maven; will ask garycmartin for advice or even Mike
10:55 sdziallas #link http://www.flickr.com/photos/enil/3892066169/ (here it is)
10:55 SeanDaly s/bouht/bought
10:56 I love nature, grass, breeze, mirabelles, and France, but you'll forgive me if I prefer an image with Sugar branding :D
10:56 sdziallas grins.
10:57 erikos SeanDaly: how about, creating a memory game with this picture?
10:57 SeanDaly sdziallas: do you have any headshots lying around?
10:57 erikos SeanDaly: there is one pair open, the mirabelle one
10:57 SeanDaly erikos: wow that would make a good Sugar screenshot
10:59 erikos: I guess the other pairs would be strawberries & blueberries & cloudberries?
10:59 erikos SeanDaly: would work, too indeed ;p
10:59 SeanDaly OK I need to go soon but one more topic
10:59 erikos SeanDaly: heh, now it comes:
10:59 strawberry and blueberry are both turned over, and one mirabelle is opne
11:00 and the cursor over another tail :)
11:00 feels too arty today
11:00 SeanDaly sdziallas I mentioned in last night's SoaS meeting problem in promoting fedora minisite for SoaS
11:00 sdziallas sorry, had somebody at the door.
11:00 is back now, reading backlog.
11:00 SeanDaly I feel strongly that the link we put in our PR (the main SoaS wiki page) should not change
11:01 sdziallas SeanDaly: uh, headshots? (sorry, can you rephrase?)
11:01 SeanDaly sdziallas: :D
11:02 it's the nice photo of you in a photographer's studio, smiling like you don't on your passport, that I send to curious journalists who want to call you and quote you :D
11:02 sdziallas SeanDaly: ahhh :)
11:03 SeanDaly: http://people.sugarlabs.org/sdz/sdziallas.jpg ?
11:03 SeanDaly I mean, a photomaton booth at the railway station will do perhaps ;-)
11:03 sdziallas: that's a nice one!
11:04 sdziallas SeanDaly: it's... I suppose one of the few that could remotely work (I usually look pretty strange on pictures)
11:04 SeanDaly so you don't mind if I give out for publication if a journalist asks? licensing and photographer credit OK?
11:04 looks very strange in photos
11:05 sdziallas SeanDaly: sure, go ahead. I think it was a classmate of mine taking it (it's in front of my former school), so I don't think that'll cause issues (it's even my camera, so... yeah).
11:06 SeanDaly "self portrait of a young man"
11:06 sdziallas grins.
11:07 SeanDaly I need to go now... any other questions or comments?
11:07 satellit_ * Note besides Mini Site: -There is a DL on http://download.sugarlabs.org/[…]s-3-mirabelle.iso  ;also (non-torrent) I think sdz put it there?
11:08 sdziallas satellit_: I put it there to not break the scheme we had before. it can't hurt to have it on dl.sl.o.
11:08 satellit_ : )
11:08 SeanDaly satellit_: my own feeling is that it's preferable downloads happen from SL site, just so we can capture the stats. But if fedora site can rack basic stats, not too much of an issue
11:08 JT4sugar satellit_, I will look at new Creation kit 9.0 later today and send you comments if that works
11:08 satellit_ great
11:08 SeanDaly s/rack/track
11:09 hi garycmartin... I'm afraid you're at the end of this...
11:09 garycmartin SeanDaly: Damn, only just got to your email today.
11:11 SeanDaly garycmartin: I am terrible at sending invites in a timely manner, but good at being present in the timeslot... I will post log shortly I just had a question for you
11:11 sdziallas SeanDaly: we've stats directly on spins.fp.o (we're over 350 downloads as of yesterday), but I bet they could get us more detailed ones, too, if we asked more.
11:11 JT4sugar SeanDaly, Having a track through Fedora to get SoaS helps our cause since Sugar is mentioned in F13 notes
11:11 SeanDaly sdziallas: all I really care about is total downloads; I imagine they don't mind if there are several thousand downloads during LinuxTag? :D
11:12 satellit_ * any way to get stats on DL of DVD from Tgillard?
11:12 sdziallas SeanDaly: I don't think they will :)
11:12 SeanDaly garycmartin: I just forwarded Mike Lee art for SoaS Creation Kit DVD
11:13 satellit_ sdziallas: any way to move DVD to download.sugarlabs..releases?
11:13 SeanDaly we are wondering if it's a lot of work (for myself, for Mike, or for you) to mirabellize logo and replace CD logo with DVD data logo
11:13 cfalciola Hi!
11:13 SeanDaly greetings cfalciola!
11:14 I'm very sorry but we are near end of meeting I need to leave soon
11:14 sdziallas satellit_: I think this is part of what needs to be discussed during the feature conversation for the next releases.
11:14 SeanDaly but has been productive will post log right after
11:14 sdziallas SeanDaly: well, thanks for the cool meeting :)
11:14 cfalciola Short , but definitely intense! :)
11:15 SeanDaly JT4sugar: I certainly think Fedora rates a mention in PR, but keep in mind Fedora brand like Sugar Labs brand is still weak; best-known brand in our ecosystem is the XO itself, but that's not what we want to show for SoaS
11:16 garycmartin SeanDaly: Got your email PDFs and eps' yea I think I can Mirabellize them send back.
11:16 SeanDaly garycmartin: fantastic! Mike Lee had done these for JT4sugar, I don't know if there are source versions or what - worth asking?
11:17 garycmartin SeanDaly: These should be fine to work on, long as they are not bitmap ;)
11:17 SeanDaly cfalciola, garycmartin: briefly, plan is to do Mirabelle media campaign with team/recruitment focus for LinuxTag around June 9
11:18 ouch need to run is that it?
11:19 garycmartin SeanDaly: Will read the logs.
11:19 SeanDaly ok many thanks to all
11:19 going once...
11:20 going twice...
11:20 #endmeeting
16:12 jelkner walterbender, jamie finished the 1st user story i asked him to do
16:12 walterbender I like the term "user story"
16:12 jelkner he now has a command line way to generate png files from ta files
16:12 walterbender that is great.
16:12 jelkner jboisture, why don't you describe what you did
16:12 walterbender jamie: do you want to post your patch for review?
16:13 jboisture well I couldn't find a way of fitting it into turtleart as it was
16:13 walterbender hmm
16:14 jboisture so its basically a new program that without all of the GUI parts instead it draws to a pixmap
16:14 walterbender that is one way to do it...
16:15 but I presume you are able to reuse most of the code
16:16 jboisture yes most of it is the same but there are some big changes I had to make in the way to it sets up the drawing envoirnment
16:16 walterbender jboisture: TA already draws to a pixmap...
16:16 I guess I don't understand why you couldn't just autoload the project and save it...
16:17 jboisture: there is a flag to set to determine if a project is run upon loading
16:17 jboisture hmm.  would there be a way to do that without any GUI so that it would run on a server
16:18 jelkner walterbender, our use case requires that
16:18 that's the point
16:18 we want a web app that takes a .ta file
16:18 walterbender and there is glue to write the canvas to a png
16:20 jboisture it actually draws now to a drawing area which can only be created on the GUI.  we wanted no GUI so we needed to switch to a using pixmap and pixbuf
16:21 walterbender Ah. Gotcha.
16:22 jboisture So do you think there would be a better way.  I would have liked to make it a command line option within turtleart, but I just didn't see a very practical way.
16:23 walterbender jboisture: send me your code and I'll look to see if there is a way to integrate it...
16:24 jelkner lfaraone, walterbender and jboisture are talking about jboisture's work to get png files generated from .ta files
16:25 lfaraone, where is the best place to host this work, so that the student intern working on the website can access it tomorrow?
16:25 walterbender jboisture: it would be cool to generalize the work so that any Sugar activity launched from the shell could render itself as PNG
16:27 jelkner waits for lfaraone to respond...
16:27 lfaraone jelkner: uh, host the png generation work?
16:27 jelkner yes
16:27 i have a senior experience student with 3 weeks to work on the turtleart website project
16:27 lfaraone jboisture, jelkner: since upstream, walterbender, uses gitorious, you should clone Walter's repo there and upload your changes.
16:28 jelkner it isn't changes, lfaraone, its a seperate app
16:29 walterbender jelkner: I agree with lfaraone; we bundle turtleart.py with TurtleArtActivity.py... we keep all the parts together in one place...
16:29 lfaraone jelkner: okay. well, it's up to you and walterbender how to organize it.
16:29 jelkner walterbender, keeping the parts together is definitely the best idea
16:29 lfaraone jelkner: I don't see a problem keeping them in separate trees, so you might as well go the gitorious route.
16:30 jelkner the easiest thing for jboisture will just be to create a launchpad sub project under sugarteam
16:30 he is already a member
16:30 and knows how to do that
16:30 walterbender from the maintenance POV, since most of the code is shared...
16:31 jelkner aaron crowe is also a team member
16:31 and i'll be able to tell him to grab it tomorrow morning
16:31 so he can continue work on the website
16:32 we only have him for 3 weeks
16:32 walterbender well, where ever it lands, I'd like to take a look.
16:32 jelkner great
16:32 lfaraone jelkner:  the issue with using Launchpad is that upstream uses a different technology.
16:32 jelkner lfaraone, i understand
16:32 it's a drawback
16:33 lfaraone jelkner: which makes it harder for walterbender to merge your changes.
16:33 jelkner but the advantages out weigh the disadvantages here
16:33 since we already know what to do
16:33 nothing new to learn
16:33 lfaraone jelkner: you can continue to use bzr with git, you just will be using the gitorious site.
16:33 jelkner lfaraone, feel free to move stuff over there
16:34 or set it up for us
16:34 jboisture ok I'm going to create a launchpad branch.  Walter, I'll send you the code so you can take a look, and I'll look at whether or not I think it could be integrated in as a command option.
16:34 jelkner sweet
16:34 walterbender jboisture: sounds good.
16:35 jelkner walterbender, the goal is for aaron crowe to have a web2py appliance that permits users to upload .ta files and makes them available for viewing and sharing
16:35 we hope to have that going in the next few weeks
16:36 walterbender jelkner: OK. that'll be great.
16:36 jelkner he'll use what jboisture just wrote to generate the png files
16:36 lfaraone jelkner: re web2py, you, myself, and morris need to meet about that.
16:36 walterbender jelkner: I need to make a new TA release soon, so I will try to land Jamie's patch
16:36 jelkner great!
16:37 and lfaraone, we need a new debian package soon, too
16:37 lfaraone jelkner: for TA?
16:37 jelkner yes
16:37 lfaraone jelkner: isn't matt on that?
16:38 jelkner that's right
16:38 walterbender jboisture: if we want to get fancy, we can do the same datahiding hack that Brian did for the Java version: put the .ta file bits encoded in the LSB of the .png
16:38 jelkner i'll ask him first then
16:39 walterbender, do you mean you can run the .ta files from the images on turtleart.org?
16:39 i never realized that
16:39 since i've never used the java version
16:39 lfaraone jelkner: I'm not sure where we stand on that. If he's ready to begin uploading to Debian Unstable, let me know and I'll have my sponsor take a look.
16:40 jelkner lfaraone, let me call him
16:40 walterbender jelkner: yes... the .ta data is "
16:40 hidden" in the image
16:40 and the java version finds it and runs it...
16:42 jboisture hmm... well I'm not sure where you would start with that, but it could be pretty cool.
16:42 walterbender jboisture: yes. let's wrap this first stage up...
16:42 jboisture yes that sounds good to me
16:43 jelkner walterbender, can we talk color?
16:44 walterbender sure
16:44 jelkner the colors now are rather limited
16:44 there is no black, for example
16:45 seems for an art project, that's something important to fix
16:45 walterbender true...
16:45 there is gray now...
16:45 jelkner since when?
16:45 and i don't really understand the color model
16:46 how the numbers correspond to things i do understand
16:46 like red green blue
16:46 walterbender jelkner: it is polar... a double cone
16:47 but it doesn't quite reach black or white
16:47 jelkner ahh
16:47 i'll have to read about that
16:47 walterbender in the Java version, there is a cheat code to get black and white
16:47 jelkner yes, -9999
16:48 why didn't you use standard r g b color?
16:48 walterbender But I would prefer to use a more common color model, such as Lab or Luv, mapped to polar coordinates.
16:48 rgb is pretty awful for specification.
16:49 jelkner ok
16:49 walterbender easy to program, hard to visualize
16:49 we def. want a hue, value, chroma system of some sort
16:50 Munsell is my personal favorite
16:50 jelkner so i'm thinking this is something jboisture could help code
16:50 *if* you gave us the rules
16:50 we want it to work like this...
16:50 walterbender jelkner: easy enough
16:50 jboisture: let me know when you want t begin on that...
16:52 jboisture lets start now, since I just finished the other project
16:52 walterbender sorry about that...
16:53 jboisture: OK. Step one is to get acquainted with Lab/Luv.
16:53 there is a decent wikipedia article
16:54 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIELUV_color_space
16:55 you'll want to map a polar coordinate system on top of it
16:55 jboisture: once you get the math sorted out, it is simply a matter of replacing the appropriate methods in tacanvas.py
16:56 rgs_ takes a look of what is being discussed..
16:56 jboisture ok well it looks like I have some reading to do
16:56 walterbender jboisture: it looks hairy, but it is still 3 numbers to describe a color
16:57 Y is black to white
16:57 and your polar coordinates describe hue (which color) and saturation (grayness)
16:58 jboisture ok but that sounds like the variables and turtle art only allows for color and shade.
16:59 walterbender jboisture: recently, I added gray
17:00 needs to take another call at 5... so we should wrap up
17:00 jelkner agrees
17:00 jboisture oh ok I didn't realize that I think I can take it from here.
17:00 jelkner cool
17:00 let's meet again next tuesday?
17:01 since jboisture will be here each tuesday
17:01 walterbender sure
17:01 jelkner with good news to report! ;-)
17:01 #endmeeting

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