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Time | Nick | Message |
---|---|---|
09:04 | unmadindu_ | gets rid of his tail |
09:04 | erikos | #TOPIC: Sugar developers meeting |
09:05 | tomeu | hi all! |
09:05 | morgs | hi! |
09:05 | tomeu | there's only one chair in this meeting? |
09:07 | erikos | Agenda of today: http://sugarlabs.org/go/Develo[…]mber_11_2008_-_14.00_.28UTC.29 |
09:07 | hi tomeu and morgs - thanks for joining in | |
09:07 | unmadindu: great you are here as well | |
09:08 | and even marcopg stays under the limit of 10 minutes late! | |
09:08 | marcopg | my default lateness is 15 minutes |
09:08 | to anything | |
09:08 | erikos | anyone else that is here for the meeting? |
09:08 | marcopg | my gf usually tells me time - 15 to ensure I'm in time |
09:08 | erikos | marcopg: you mean i should be happy that you are here already? |
09:08 | marcopg | erikos: yup! |
09:09 | erikos | marcopg: hmm we can clear that in detail later :) |
09:09 | ok first item of today: | |
09:09 | a) Schedule: adjust feature freeze | |
09:09 | as you may have noticed - our schedule is currently a bit tough | |
09:10 | our feature freeze would be next week already | |
09:10 | we want to stick to ship something in march | |
09:10 | and to the way we do coordinated releases | |
09:10 | the feature freeze we would like to move to a later date? | |
09:11 | comments? | |
09:11 | http://sugarlabs.org/go/Develo[…]/Roadmap#Schedule | |
09:11 | tomeu | well, I sure have lots of bugs to put in |
09:11 | erikos | ^^^ |
09:11 | tomeu | s/bugs/features |
09:12 | erikos | hello bertf still in time (current topic: a) Schedule: adjust feature freeze) |
09:12 | marcopg | OLPC is apparently planning to discuss 9.1 stuff at the xocamp |
09:12 | meaning, they will see which features are more or less ready | |
09:12 | and try to get them in by the end of january or something | |
09:13 | bertf | or something. didn't seem consensus was reached yesterday |
09:13 | marcopg | yeah |
09:13 | tomeu | how does that affect sugar? |
09:13 | erikos | marcopg: how does that have concrete effects to our schedule? |
09:14 | marcopg | well if I we can play nicely with olpc we should, since it's our main customer |
09:14 | on the other hand I don't really want to give up on time based releases | |
09:14 | i.e. if gets pushed after end of january I don't think we will be able to accomodate it | |
09:15 | tomeu | marcopg: ok about playing nice, but what can we do about that? |
09:16 | erikos | marcopg: what policy would you suggest? |
09:16 | marcopg | we could reschedule our freeze to the end of january |
09:17 | but then stick to it | |
09:17 | tomeu | heh, we could get lots of buddies from now to then |
09:17 | if we can focus on code | |
09:17 | marcopg: do you think we'll have enough time to stabilize stuff? | |
09:18 | morgs | The ubuntu packaging has to have a decision very soon about whether to start including 0.83 with a view to shipping 0.84, or staying on 0.82 - the Ubuntu jaunty featurefreeze is Feb 19, so do you think there will be any impact to the 0.84 release date? |
09:18 | erikos | morgs: good point |
09:18 | tomeu | which other freezes do we have around that time? |
09:19 | F11? | |
09:19 | erikos | looks as F11 schedule |
09:19 | marcopg | morgs: no, the idea is to keep release date the same |
09:19 | erikos | https://fedoraproject.org/wiki[…]eases/11/Schedule |
09:20 | 2009-03-03 feature freeze | |
09:21 | marcopg: i think our decision when freeze will be should be made - dependent on the timeleft to stabilize | |
09:21 | tomeu | what means the distros feature freezes? that only bugfixes can get in? |
09:21 | morgs | yes |
09:21 | tomeu | do we need to follow any process on their side to assure them that those are only bugfixes? |
09:21 | morgs | in ubuntu, it means no new package versions, unless you get an exception |
09:21 | tomeu | in other words: only can get fixed the bugs that are tracked there? |
09:21 | marcopg | erikos: end of january seems like enough to stabilize, *seem* |
09:22 | morgs | tomeu: when uploading during the intrepid cycle after the feature freeze date, they wanted to see changelogs for uploads to see that no new features were added |
09:22 | erikos | marcopg: see, in the end it is our product that we present |
09:22 | marcopg: if it sucks they claim it to us | |
09:23 | marcopg | sure |
09:23 | so let's forget olpc for a minute | |
09:23 | and try to figure out what would be the best date to freeze | |
09:23 | it seem like some of us would also like to have more time | |
09:24 | erikos | yeah |
09:24 | tomeu | more time to code new features or to stabilize? |
09:25 | erikos | we have christmas and new year as well in between |
09:25 | morgs | grr, I can't find the actual feature list on the wiki |
09:25 | erikos | so the time in between 24-31 will likely see not so much code |
09:26 | marcopg | yup |
09:26 | we basically have 10 days | |
09:27 | erikos | so until the 17th january we have 4 coding weeks |
09:27 | marcopg | what is the current freeze date? |
09:27 | 17 jan? I thought earlier | |
09:27 | unmadindu | 21st |
09:27 | morgs | Dec 21 |
09:27 | erikos | i was just picking a date in january |
09:28 | how about the 24th - that gives us 5 coding weeks? | |
09:28 | and 5 stabilizing weeks | |
09:30 | marcopg | 5 stabilizing weeks |
09:30 | seems a little short | |
09:30 | erikos | ok 17th of january? |
09:30 | 4 code - 6 stabilizing ones | |
09:31 | (and fudcon in between as well) | |
09:31 | marcopg | erikos: I think it's mainly up to you and tomeu |
09:31 | tomeu | 4/6 |
09:31 | marcopg | I don't plan to write new fetaures at all |
09:32 | tomeu | marcopg: but will you be able to resist the need? ;) |
09:32 | I mean, the christmas holidays are for playing, after all | |
09:32 | marcopg | resist the need? ;) |
09:32 | heh I suspect I'll play with collab | |
09:33 | we really really need to make the damned thing work | |
09:33 | erikos | me i have to finish NM and the gconf transition |
09:33 | tomeu | marcopg: you'd better fix presence, ir my FT work won't serve much |
09:33 | marcopg | right |
09:33 | erikos | oh and the mesh view as well |
09:34 | marcopg | it seem like the only one really planning features is tomeu |
09:34 | and there is possibly journal2 by olpc | |
09:35 | morgs | Did cscott present any features at SugarCamp which are to be implemented in Sugar (by him)? |
09:35 | marcopg | journal and some collab stuff |
09:36 | I propose that we let tomeu decide a date | |
09:36 | erikos | ok i think we are drifting off now |
09:36 | marcopg | based on the features he wants to land |
09:37 | then we announce it on the mailing list | |
09:37 | tomeu | I would prefer 4 coding weeks and 6 fixing weeks |
09:37 | marcopg | and if no one complains we stick with it |
09:37 | erikos | taken by me |
09:37 | morgs | +1 |
09:37 | marcopg | fine by me |
09:37 | we need an action to send mail | |
09:37 | who takes it? | |
09:37 | erikos | around the 17th we do then feature freeze |
09:37 | marcopg | erikos maybe? ;) |
09:38 | tomeu | loves erikos announcements |
09:38 | marcopg | tomeu: that's why I propose him! :) |
09:38 | erikos | #ACTION adjust feature freeze and announce it (erikos) |
09:38 | marcopg | yay ;) |
09:38 | tomeu | nice |
09:38 | erikos | next topic |
09:38 | b) create a short term TODO list of items (i.e. collaboration rock) and find owners and priorities | |
09:38 | marcopg | erikos: feel free to refactor a bit the schedule to accomodate releases |
09:38 | erikos: (as we discussed yesterday) | |
09:39 | erikos | marcopg: sure - i will get back to you with my plan |
09:39 | marcopg: can you explain - what we discusssed yesterday about the TODO list? | |
09:39 | explain/sum up | |
09:39 | marcopg | ok, to make it clear the target of these items is 1/2 weeks max |
09:40 | we should add stuff we are already working on | |
09:40 | (tomeu ft for example) | |
09:40 | tomeu | - usb sticks in the journal |
09:40 | marcopg | and stuff that needs to be done |
09:40 | tomeu | works but is very hacky |
09:40 | marcopg | perhaps we start from what we are working on? |
09:40 | erikos | http://sugarlabs.org/go/DevelopmentTeam/TODO |
09:40 | marcopg | so we know owners already |
09:40 | erikos | that is the page btw |
09:41 | marcopg | erikos: we need to make nice tables at some point, maybe not now though |
09:41 | erikos | marcopg: now we only need something we can work on ;p |
09:41 | marcopg | for this meeting I'd be content with a list of item+owner |
09:41 | tomeu | gadget? |
09:41 | marcopg | let's start from what we are working on already |
09:41 | and hope to finish in 1-2 weeks max | |
09:41 | erikos: can you write down the items please? | |
09:42 | erikos | uff |
09:42 | marcopg | I have too main items: |
09:42 | * Get to the point where we can effectively dogfood collaboration | |
09:43 | erikos | done |
09:43 | marcopg | * Restructure the DevelopmentTeam wiki (later I want to start adding documentation |
09:44 | tomeu: ? | |
09:44 | tomeu | I have FT and removable devices in the journal |
09:44 | marcopg | ok cool |
09:44 | erikos: ? | |
09:44 | erikos | please phrase it into two items |
09:44 | marcopg | (also erikos are you writing these down) |
09:45 | morgs | xobot: take notes |
09:45 | xobot | morgs, my handwriting is unreadable! |
09:45 | erikos | yup |
09:45 | tomeu | - implement journal entry transfer |
09:45 | - finish support for removable devices in the journal | |
09:45 | marcopg | cool |
09:45 | morgs | I'm making PS a bit more controllable from the control panel - to restart gabble without needing to restart Sugar |
09:46 | (to switch between jabber servers, ...) | |
09:46 | marcopg | great, erikos please take note ;) |
09:46 | erikos | i do i do :) |
09:46 | marcopg | unmadindu: ? |
09:47 | working on any sugar coolness in the next 1-2 weeks? | |
09:47 | unmadindu | new language packs (I'm not sure if that is directly related to sugar) |
09:47 | tomeu | morgs: that's cool |
09:47 | marcopg | unmadindu: is it going to implemented in a distro specific way? |
09:48 | unmadindu | yeah - at the moment, yes, unless I can get upstream glibc/python to accept our patches |
09:48 | marcopg | ok, so perhaps for now it's more of an olpc thing |
09:49 | unmadindu | yeah |
09:49 | marcopg | ok, I think only erikos is left then |
09:49 | erikos | one sec |
09:50 | unmadindu: the language section you did in the control panel | |
09:50 | unmadindu: are you planning to change it to the 'gdm' way | |
09:51 | unmadindu | erikos: yeah, I would be polishing that up |
09:51 | erikos | unmadindu: eben seemed to like it that way |
09:51 | unmadindu | erikos: yeah |
09:51 | erikos: though it might have performance issues | |
09:51 | erikos | unmadindu: that would be more than cool - shall i add it? |
09:51 | unmadindu | sure |
09:51 | marcopg | great! |
09:51 | erikos | unmadindu: yeah, performance - we can at least try :) |
09:52 | unmadindu | lol, yeah |
09:52 | tomeu | I think caroline was interested in doing some work on groups |
09:52 | anyone has more details about that? | |
09:52 | erikos | i will do more NM work - connect to preferred connection, use gconf instead of our own conf file |
09:53 | marcopg | she codes? ;) |
09:53 | erikos | and support for wired devices |
09:53 | have just to structure it a bit - into small action items | |
09:54 | marcopg | what you just said is fine for the todo I think |
09:54 | anything else? | |
09:54 | erikos | unmadindu: do you know the ticket number ? |
09:54 | unmadindu | http://dev.sugarlabs.org/ticket/51 |
09:54 | tomeu | marcopg: I think caroline_ does code, but she mentioned someone else working on that |
09:54 | marcopg | otherwise we can move to stuff that *must* be done |
09:55 | erikos | unmadindu: thanks |
09:55 | unmadindu | marcopg: I would also like to sit down with you one of these days on RTL support |
09:55 | marcopg | unmadindu: put it on the TODO! |
09:55 | unmadindu | I'm not sure if I would be able to find the time, but it is high priority for me |
09:55 | marcopg | let's at least try |
09:55 | unmadindu | erikos: ^^^^^^^^^^^^ |
09:55 | ok | |
09:56 | erikos | adds that |
09:56 | marcopg | tomeu: oh she really codes? wow |
09:56 | we need to close in one hour today | |
09:56 | counts down on stuff we are workin on... | |
09:56 | 5 | |
09:56 | 4 | |
09:56 | 3 | |
09:56 | 2 | |
09:56 | 1 | |
09:56 | 0.5 | |
09:56 | 0.2 | |
09:56 | done! | |
09:56 | now stuff that *have* to be done | |
09:57 | let's just list them and then we try to find owners | |
09:57 | * I need buildbot back, I really do. | |
09:57 | * We need to move to use git.sugarlabs.org, and figure out conventions/policies to use it properly | |
09:58 | * We need to fix the damned palettes, they are seriously too broken. | |
09:59 | no one else has ideas other than me!? :) | |
09:59 | erikos | has to take too many notes |
10:00 | marcopg | * Related to git probably, we need to figure out trac workflow, add components etc. |
10:00 | tomeu | hmm, the logout option |
10:00 | some screen issues like those in the control panel | |
10:00 | font size on other resolutions | |
10:00 | erikos | marcopg: well trac is on the bugsquad TODO list |
10:00 | marcopg | morgs: unmadindu you must have some idea ;) |
10:01 | erikos: oh kill that! | |
10:01 | I mean from our todo | |
10:01 | erikos | marcopg: i did not add it :) |
10:01 | marcopg | yeah I did, but you kill |
10:01 | unmadindu | the control panel resizing issue (for non en_US languages) |
10:02 | erikos | marcopg: where did you add it? |
10:02 | marcopg | unmadindu: huh oh true |
10:02 | morgs | * Better separation of XO features in the control panel so they can be removed for distros |
10:02 | marcopg | erikos: forget, my brain is seriously melted |
10:02 | tomeu | good one from morgs |
10:02 | morgs | - About my computer instead of About my XO... |
10:02 | erikos | morgs: yup |
10:03 | marcopg | ok |
10:03 | 5 | |
10:03 | 4 | |
10:03 | 3 | |
10:03 | 2 | |
10:03 | 1 | |
10:03 | unmadindu | http://dev.laptop.org/ticket/7728 (if someone can figure out what this is - it seems to affect a number of device icons) |
10:03 | tomeu | adding buddies not tracked in the PS |
10:03 | marcopg | gah I was almost done |
10:04 | unmadindu | :) |
10:04 | erikos | aehm all the last points - do we add them now? |
10:04 | marcopg | yeah add them |
10:04 | 0.5 | |
10:04 | 0.2 | |
10:04 | 0.1 | |
10:04 | done! | |
10:04 | tomeu | marcopg: cannot count so fast! |
10:05 | erikos | and owners? |
10:05 | marcopg | ok, we have 4 minutes to figure out some owners |
10:05 | erikos: can you put the list up? | |
10:05 | erikos | i must first go through them and add them |
10:05 | morgs | tomeu: don't believe all Gregorio's "feature" requests... :) |
10:05 | marcopg | fast fast! |
10:05 | (what else is on agenda?) | |
10:06 | tomeu | morgs: hmm, for example? |
10:06 | marcopg | erikos: please give it numbers, so we can more easily take them |
10:07 | morgs | "show buddies PS doesn't know about because of bugs in the collaboration stack" |
10:07 | tomeu | morgs: oh, was rather thinking on what cassidy said in the sugarcamp |
10:07 | morgs | ah OK :) |
10:07 | tomeu | morgs: have a way to add a jid to your friends view, for example |
10:08 | I guess FT is going to work fine with other clients | |
10:08 | morgs | tomeu: OK we can chat later |
10:08 | tomeu | ok |
10:08 | cassidy | hu? who summoned me ? :) |
10:09 | tomeu | ;) just mentioned that would be nice to have a way to add non-PS buddies |
10:09 | so we can chat and send files with other desktops | |
10:09 | marcopg | erikos: let's reschedule getting involved to next week btw (shame, but...) |
10:09 | cassidy | that should work now in sugar-jhbuild |
10:09 | erikos | all up now |
10:09 | cassidy | PS doesn't ignore non-sugar buddies anymore |
10:09 | (aka contact without key) | |
10:10 | tomeu | cassidy: you don't need to add them manually? can we autodiscover them? |
10:10 | marcopg | cassidy: there seems to be still several bugs in presence even with gadget btw :( will spend more time tracking it down |
10:10 | cassidy | tomeu: well, you'll see them automatically in Salut |
10:10 | marcopg | we need to get collab to work! |
10:11 | cassidy | didn't test with Gabble but you *should* see contacts if they are in your roster |
10:11 | marcopg | erikos: let us know when you are done |
10:11 | cassidy | but, yes, we need UI to add contact from their jid |
10:11 | tomeu | cassidy: ok, so I guess that I was mentioning was to add contacts to the jabber roster |
10:11 | cassidy | marcopg: I'm sure there are bugs in Gadget. The good news is that their should be easily fixable (while the shared roster ones are not) |
10:12 | tomeu: there is a bug opened about that | |
10:12 | marcopg | yeah, also I'm sure there are bugs in ps and UI |
10:12 | we "just" need to fix all of them | |
10:12 | cassidy | bugs erverywhere ! |
10:12 | tomeu | good to have a plan so simple |
10:13 | cassidy | tomeu: https://dev.laptop.org/ticket/8841 |
10:13 | I'll be happy to help on the TP part is someone wants to write a GUI for this | |
10:13 | erikos | with number now |
10:13 | morgs | marcopg: PS has quite a lot of pseudo-blocking dbus-python calls - I've been looking and it will be a nightmare to convert them all to async but I think that's one cause of unreliability |
10:13 | marcopg | erikos: where they are? |
10:14 | erikos | marcopg: reload |
10:14 | http://sugarlabs.org/go/DevelopmentTeam/TODO | |
10:14 | marcopg | erikos: reload what ;) |
10:14 | aaah | |
10:14 | wow | |
10:14 | ok so I can champion 8 | |
10:14 | I basically need someone to give me a F10 box :) | |
10:15 | if you hear about any possibilities to host build slaves please let me knwo | |
10:15 | cassidy | FYI my priorities are now a) get p2p stream tubes merged b) continue FT implementation in Gabble |
10:15 | erikos | marcopg: maybe we can ask in fedora land? |
10:15 | cassidy | I'm working on a) atm |
10:16 | marcopg | erikos: seems to be difficult to get full machines there |
10:16 | tomeu | cassidy: a) won't require no sugar work, right? |
10:16 | marcopg | please take some items! |
10:16 | cassidy | tomeu: not at all |
10:16 | tomeu | cassidy: we'll just see less server load? |
10:16 | same for b), cool | |
10:16 | cassidy | that's the whole point of TP, you continue to use the existing API and benefits implementation improvements |
10:17 | tomeu | cassidy: about #8841, is quite a bit of work, not sure we'll find time |
10:17 | yup | |
10:17 | marcopg | tomeu: erikos morgs unmadindu please take items ;) |
10:17 | cassidy | tomeu: that means stream tube will use p2p connections when it's possible (contacts are on the same network) instead of sending it throught the server |
10:17 | erikos | marcopg: ok lets do it like this |
10:17 | tomeu | oh, since when do we have so nice tables in the wiki? |
10:17 | marcopg | takes 8 and 9 |
10:17 | morgs | took 15 |
10:18 | marcopg | tomeu: eben did them I think |
10:18 | cassidy | at some point we'll probably implement sock5 relay too |
10:18 | tomeu | nice, collabora has a train full of goodies for us ;) |
10:18 | marcopg | tomeu: maybe you want 16 while you are working on collab? |
10:18 | erikos | marcopg: we have the items now up - now people just take items - don't need to wait here now (this covers point c of the agenda as well) |
10:18 | unmadindu | takes 11 |
10:18 | erikos | marcopg: getting involved |
10:18 | marcopg | erikos: no no items needs an owner |
10:18 | tomeu | marcopg: I can take, but I'm not sure I'll have time to implement all of it |
10:19 | marcopg | otherwise they get dropped to another list ;) |
10:19 | erikos | takes 13 |
10:19 | marcopg | takes also 10 |
10:20 | tomeu | I can take 11, 12 and 14 |
10:20 | oh, unmadindu took 11, cool! | |
10:20 | erikos | i just took 14 :) |
10:20 | tomeu | so maybe could do 16 |
10:21 | erikos | marcopg: i guess you take 10 then :))) |
10:21 | marcopg: it is all your fault in the end | |
10:21 | marcopg | wow only two left |
10:21 | tomeu | tell me when you have finished, I'll see if there's anything left :p |
10:21 | marcopg | no one left! |
10:21 | yay :) | |
10:22 | tomeu: you take 12 and 16 right? | |
10:22 | erikos | finished! |
10:22 | tomeu | taken |
10:22 | marcopg | wow this was call |
10:22 | erikos | if you are all as good in coding than in champoining - we have soon the greatest platform ever :) |
10:22 | marcopg | cool |
10:23 | ok, so | |
10:23 | erikos | lets see next week - how much you get done! you rock! |
10:23 | marcopg | any action item for next week? |
10:23 | tomeu | think so ;) |
10:23 | morgs | has to go, will catch up any last things later |
10:23 | marcopg | I'd like to see more people to the meeting |
10:23 | benzea gary mtd etc | |
10:23 | erikos | eben! |
10:23 | marcopg | eben yeah |
10:24 | eben | erikos: yes? |
10:24 | marcopg | should we try to invite them directly? |
10:24 | tomeu | cassidy features should be in that roadmap? or are considered work on dependencies |
10:24 | marcopg | eben: you always miss devs meeting! |
10:24 | erikos | eben: do you need direct invitation? |
10:24 | eben: is it too early for you? | |
10:24 | eben | marcopg: I've been online the whole time, and even in this room....unfortunately I was distracted... |
10:24 | marcopg | eben: argh! |
10:25 | eben: please don't be distracted next week ;) | |
10:25 | eben | Trying to get things done for th design meeting, which I didn't accomplish, so I think I need to postpone it anyway. |
10:25 | marcopg | we want you to take stuff on the todo and start coding again :P |
10:25 | eben | marcopg: :) |
10:25 | I need help with hyperactivity... | |
10:25 | erikos | eben: yeah we missed you a bit over the last weeks :/ |
10:25 | eben | I started the patch to make groups something more interesting, and got stuck. |
10:25 | marcopg | eben: cassidy is here ;) |
10:25 | ok let's close this meeting | |
10:26 | tomeu | eben: we should talk with caroline_ and ask her what they need about groups, we may be able to do something for 0.84 |
10:26 | marcopg | but let's have an action to get moe people |
10:26 | erikos | marcopg: one sec |
10:26 | marcopg | I can take it |
10:26 | eben | tomeu: Er....groups view, which is partially independent. |
10:26 | erikos | marcopg: yup - please take that one |
10:26 | marcopg | we are 18 mins late |
10:26 | tomeu | eben: oh, is it? |
10:26 | eben | tomeu: But yes, it would be great to talk more about groups in genera; |
10:26 | tomeu: well, right now it's just a list of buddies... | |
10:26 | erikos | #ACTION invite more people to the dev meeting (marcopg) |
10:27 | marcopg | next week we are going to do exactly 1 hour! |
10:27 | tomeu | eben: can you add your work items to the TODO table? http://sugarlabs.org/go/Develo[…]TODO#Active_Tasks |
10:27 | erikos | one last word before we close: |
10:27 | eben | the plan is that it be a view just like the neighborhood, with activities and grouping and such, but that you just see your friends |
10:27 | erikos | we will go next week through the todo list and see which items have been closed! |
10:27 | marcopg | eben: note that they are 1-2 weeks in scope, and you need an owner for each |
10:27 | tomeu | eben: isn't that what we have today? |
10:27 | eben | tomeu: no, right now it's just a static list of friends... |
10:27 | marcopg | erikos: yeah and hopefully add more |
10:28 | tomeu | marcopg: 16 will take longer, most probably |
10:28 | erikos | thanks everyone for joining in |
10:28 | we close in 5 | |
10:28 | 4 | |
10:28 | 3 | |
10:28 | 2 | |
10:28 | 1 | |
10:28 | 0.5 | |
10:28 | tomeu | erikos: thanks for leading the meeting! |
10:28 | erikos | 0 |
10:28 | #endmeeting |
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