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| Time | Nick | Message |
|---|---|---|
| 00:01 | Nubae | ok.... as it stands we have varous continents as I see it where people are interested in our server line of product lines, some of which dont exist, others of which are consulting/teaching/lecturing/bug fixing/adding additional specs/deleting crap from platform |
| 00:01 | think thats about it | |
| 00:03 | so far we've had only one of these... a consuting piece asking how to redirect DNS to a different ip (I dont want to use the work dns poisoning) | |
| 00:03 | ;p | |
| 00:04 | we should outline our services and products | |
| 00:04 | just like most companies do | |
| 00:04 | website is natural to that of course | |
| 00:04 | bernie | sorry, i don't know the background... is this related to the XS or another thing? |
| 00:05 | Nubae | last week... activites.sugarlabs.org was to be redirected to a local Py server |
| 00:05 | in case of outages | |
| 00:05 | bernie | yes? |
| 00:05 | Nubae | we used DNS masq |
| 00:05 | as it allows dnspoisoning... bing does not | |
| 00:06 | it was a quick fix | |
| 00:06 | bernie | ah ok. let's continue on the customers topic |
| 00:07 | Nubae | but it worked and will probably set the stage for a more complex caching deamon whereby we can get offline sites to serve slow changing content |
| 00:07 | right... I'm saying, that was a server customer | |
| 00:07 | bernie | (no tech details on this topic please, those should come last) |
| 00:08 | Nubae | agreed, little tech as possible |
| 00:08 | so back to website with services and products | |
| 00:08 | bernie | excuse me, who's this customer? |
| 00:08 | Nubae | Paraguayedyca |
| 00:09 | educa sorry | |
| 00:09 | bernie | ah ok |
| 00:10 | any other (potential) customer? | |
| 00:10 | m_anish | tch, i'm half awake on this channel :) |
| 00:10 | replaceafill <replaceafill!~replaceaf unaffiliated/replaceafill> has joined #dextrose |
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| 00:11 | Nubae | well, there are ongoing talks with .au but since they are in mid deployment we wont hear much from them for a couple weeks |
| 00:11 | bernie | m_anish: hello |
| 00:11 | Nubae | once again though... we need to advertise what services/products are being offered |
| 00:12 | bernie | Nubae: to recap, at this time we have two potential customers: Paraguay Educa and OLPC.AU. Correct? |
| 00:13 | Nubae | bernie what is our net so to speak of `potential customers? |
| 00:13 | well, those are teh ones I know of... but I'm pretty sure, we could work with Uy too... if we got introduced, understoood their systems, etc | |
| 00:13 | bernie | Nubae: those who are realistically interested in our product at this time. not all the olpc deployments out there. |
| 00:14 | Nubae: for example, not uruguay, because they're happy with their own schoolserver so it seems unlikely that they'd switch to ours anytime soon | |
| 00:14 | Nubae | also... anyway using the XS as is (Fedora based) might need help and we could offer our services there too |
| 00:14 | bernie | (this topic has been going for 15 minutes. better try to find what the needs of these customers are before we switch) |
| 00:15 | Nubae | well we wouldnt want them to switch, we would want to show them some possible enhancements |
| 00:15 | m_anish | silently waves to bernie |
| 00:15 | Nubae | which is why I really want to know a breakdown of their tehcnical strategies |
| 00:15 | bernie | Nubae: that's too much in the future, let's concentrate on few, very likely customers for now. |
| 00:15 | Nubae | is is so hard to get that? |
| 00:16 | seems to me Uy is next door | |
| 00:16 | but ok, if u say its closed for the moment, then its closed... | |
| 00:16 | bernie | Nubae: i've been in .uy and spoke to them. my sense is that it's unlikely we'll sell to them for now. |
| 00:17 | Nubae | iis there at leaszt someone I could emal there to talk to? |
| 00:17 | I would not focus on sellling, but on gathering how they've se themselves up | |
| 00:17 | bernie | Nubae: we're not AC's marketing :) |
| 00:18 | Nubae: shall we continue with these two customers, Paraguay Educa and OLPC.AU ? | |
| 00:18 | Nubae | i get that, but I cant build a product if I dont know what Uy has? |
| 00:18 | it seems silly to alienate everyone, dont u think? | |
| 00:19 | bernie | Nubae: for now, .uy is not our target (unless dfarning tells us so, of course) |
| 00:19 | Nubae | yes, for now, its just Py, with little to no ideas about what olpc.au would like... |
| 00:20 | about as little idea as what Uy is doing | |
| 00:20 | bernie | ok, i was hoping you could tell me more about olpc.au |
| 00:20 | Nubae | does what I'm saying not make sense? |
| 00:20 | replaceafill has quit IRC | |
| 00:20 | bernie | we could ask dfarning if we could have an irc meeting or confcall with the olpc.au guy to discuss their needs |
| 00:21 | so we're left with PyEdu. the good news is that i have a very good idea of what their needs are. | |
| 00:21 | the bad news is that they're not interested in replacing the school servers this year. | |
| 00:21 | Nubae | I can show you their public tracker https://dev.laptop.org.au/projects/xs-au |
| 00:22 | bernie | (looking at it) |
| 00:22 | m_anish | bernie, did carlos ping you, re: iptables/rules/setup problems, i was away all day sorting out my visa issues |
| 00:23 | bernie | Nubae: would you like me to summarize PyEdu's current implementation of XS + XM or do you know it already? |
| 00:23 | Nubae | thts fine... its going to take is a while to show a dman kick ass product, which will hopefully turn heads bi natter what previous background |
| 00:23 | bernie | m_anish: yes, he pinged me yesterday... but i had no time to respond. i dunno if he's done |
| 00:24 | Nubae | bernie please do |
| 00:24 | I kinda feel I'm in the dark | |
| 00:24 | and working on problems the minute they arise, then making ugly hacks | |
| 00:25 | bernie | ok. PyEdu's offices are in Asuncion, the capital. The office has a low-speed ADSL uplink and a 10mbit VPN going to the deployment site |
| 00:25 | in the server room of PyEdu, there's a minitower case labeled "mothership" | |
| 00:25 | this is the equivalent of our XM | |
| 00:26 | it lives behind NAT, so it's not publicly accessible by anyone | |
| 00:26 | this is important for them for security and also because they have only one IP for the whole office | |
| 00:26 | mothership runs 2-3 things: | |
| 00:26 | 1) a puppet master | |
| 00:26 | 2) the OLPC OATS server | |
| 00:27 | 3) cronjobs to sync content on the schoolservers | |
| 00:27 | 4) (not really) remote backups of all the school servers | |
| 00:27 | Nubae | hmmm |
| 00:27 | bernie | 4 is not for real because the bandwidth proved to be insufficient for the amount data to backup |
| 00:28 | ok, this is the XM side | |
| 00:28 | in Caacupe, which is 1.5h away from Asuncion, there are 10 old schoolservers + 25 new ones | |
| 00:28 | the old ones i know well: they were XS 0.6 with plenty of customizations | |
| 00:28 | Nubae | some simple shell scripting could fix bu 4 |
| 00:28 | bernie | the XS are puppet slaves, of course |
| 00:29 | Nubae | s/bu/bug |
| 00:29 | m_anish | bernie, ok i'll check |
| 00:29 | bernie, thanks! | |
| 00:29 | bernie | if i remember correctly, they try to connect to mothership on a weird port which is forwarded with DNAT by the gateway |
| 00:30 | (believe me, i tried to fix 4 with more than simple shell scripting, but i was unsuccessful) | |
| 00:30 | continuing: | |
| 00:30 | the schoolservers in Caacupe are desktop computers with some crap mobo and only one HD | |
| 00:30 | why not RAID1? because the cost was deemed too high | |
| 00:31 | from time to time, an XS breaks and needs to be serviced | |
| 00:31 | there are 2 or 3 full-time technicians in Caacupe running around the schools to keep the servers and XOs working | |
| 00:31 | the XS in the schools are inside a metal cage (anti theft) | |
| 00:31 | they all have 2 (or 3) ethernet ports: | |
| 00:32 | 1) connected to the wimax radio (which looks like a regular router, we don't care about the details) | |
| 00:32 | 2) connected to the school LAN (which is a stupid switch + a bunch of cheap access points) | |
| 00:33 | there's a huge mess with bonding and bridged interfaces which is *totally* useless and should not be supported in newer XS releases | |
| 00:33 | (fyi, it was a crazy idea to support the mesh through "active antennas", which were never produced because access points cost less and work better) | |
| 00:34 | ||
| 00:34 | tch | m_anish: feedback and activities both reachable from outside :) |
| 00:34 | bernie | ok, what do the XSes do in each school? |
| 00:34 | m_anish | bernie, ^^ |
| 00:34 | bows to tch | |
| 00:34 | bernie | 1) registration of laptops (using a custom rpm package made by olpc) |
| 00:35 | Nubae | bernie thats been taken out in ,au |
| 00:35 | bernie | 2) backups of journals (another custom package) |
| 00:35 | Nubae | I've already integrated that part into our new kickstart files |
| 00:36 | bernie | 3) distribution of activation keys (that's complicated, but .py can't leave without this so we must support it if we want to work with them. it will take a lot of time, unfortunately) |
| 00:36 | 4) collaboration server (the ejabberd crap) | |
| 00:36 | 5) content distribution (they use plone, iirc... not sure if we'd have to support that) | |
| 00:37 | Nubae | ok, interrupting just a sec with ejabberd |
| 00:37 | bernie | j0\ |
| 00:37 | Nubae: no | |
| 00:37 | Nubae | ok, illl wait |
| 00:37 | :-) | |
| 00:37 | bernie | Nubae: please let's not talk about ANY solution at this time |
| 00:37 | Nubae: i don't want us to go unfocused and fail to follow the agenda this time | |
| 00:38 | Nubae | it was a questio |
| 00:38 | not solution | |
| 00:38 | bernie | Nubae: if it's a question about how ejabberd works now at PyEdu, this is the right time to ask it :) |
| 00:40 | Nubae | im confused now.... can i ask or not? |
| 00:40 | ok, I just will | |
| 00:40 | how many users per classroom use ejabberd at any one time | |
| 00:41 | how manu users in the school use ejabberd at any one time | |
| 00:42 | what kind of collaborative actvities are most being used? | |
| 00:42 | bernie | the biggest schools have 1200 kids |
| 00:42 | and i've seen teachers *try* to use collaboration with 20 or so kids | |
| 00:42 | but a classroom could have 30-40 kids | |
| 00:42 | Nubae | is ejabberd running in loadbalanced manner anywhere? |
| 00:42 | bernie | no of course not |
| 00:42 | they have just one XS per school | |
| 00:43 | i'm trying to remember if i missed anything important on the XS. | |
| 00:43 | Nubae | 1200 kids and 1 XS?? really? |
| 00:43 | bernie | ah, yes |
| 00:43 | how they're installed! | |
| 00:43 | they get bought with a bid by the local techies (which are called CATS, btw) | |
| 00:44 | yes, only one XS | |
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| 00:45 | bernie | ok, found: the biggest school has 1400 students |
| 00:45 | Nubae | damn.... ok, next question then is specs |
| 00:45 | bernie | i have data on all schools |
| 00:45 | anyway, let's aim for a scalability of 1000 or so. | |
| 00:45 | Nubae | please please send me |
| 00:45 | bernie | i could check the specs now but we're running out of time |
| 00:45 | we're 45mins into the first topic | |
| 00:45 | we should switch | |
| 00:46 | Nubae | i wanna see where bottle necks are and see how we can fight them |
| 00:46 | bernie | ok, this is what the customers currently use |
| 00:46 | Nubae | they're always fightable |
| 00:46 | bernie | i have a good sense of what the bottlenecks are |
| 00:46 | but let's discuss them another time | |
| 00:46 | ah, forgot: | |
| 00:46 | Nubae | ok, email again |
| 00:46 | bernie | 6) web cache (squid) |
| 00:47 | 7) web filtering (can't remember what... a weird tool) | |
| 00:47 | Nubae | i'll remind at end of meeting |
| 00:47 | bernie | set action items |
| 00:47 | #action bernie send specs of the PyEdu schoolservers to dextrose@ | |
| 00:47 | damn bot | |
| 00:48 | #stopmeeting | |
| 00:48 | ok, it just died! | |
| 00:48 | #startmeeting | |
| 00:48 | meeting | bernie: Error: Can't start another meeting, one is in progress. |
| 00:49 | bernie | #topic goals |
| 00:49 | ok, to cut it short: | |
| 00:49 | goal #1: meet or exceed all the current features in use at PyEduca | |
| 00:50 | Nubae | bernie squidguard, wwwoffle, bdjdns, dansguardian |
| 00:50 | or the visual control center | |
| 00:50 | bernie | to explode the goal into individual items, we should do all the things that i listed above (points 1 to 7) using the same software if possible or better software if we have to |
| 00:52 | Nubae: here are the specs: | |
| 00:52 | Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU E7400 @ 2.80GHz | |
| 00:52 | MemTotal: 2065036 kB | |
| 00:53 | OLPC School Server release 9-0.6 | |
| 00:53 | HD 500GB | |
| 00:54 | Nubae: i need to take a typing break of 5 mins. | |
| 01:03 | Nubae: ok, i'm back | |
| 01:03 | back to the goals topic | |
| 01:04 | i think matching the capabilities of the current PyEdu setup is a modest goal that we can achieve pretty easily | |
| 01:04 | we may want to do even better, of course, but we don't have to | |
| 01:05 | just providing a *supported* XS + XM bundle which works well for one deployment is sufficient for now | |
| 01:06 | the only change we know we want to do is rebasing everything on a recent version of linux so we can make it work with hw you can buy today | |
| 01:06 | for this, we seem to have chosen RHEL6 | |
| 01:06 | tch has left #dextrose | |
| 01:07 | bernie | goal #2: rebase all OLPC & PyEdu services on RHEL6 |
| 01:07 | there's yet another goal: ease of use | |
| 01:07 | in .py, technicians don't really know linux that well | |
| 01:08 | it's easy to imagine that it's going to be this way everywhere | |
| 01:08 | so i'm going to add: | |
| 01:09 | goal #3: make the installation of XS and XM possible from a single CD, with minimal or no network connectivity, with minimal or no shell interaction | |
| 01:09 | Nubae has quit IRC | |
| 01:09 | bernie | this is though... |
| 01:09 | oops | |
| 01:17 | Nubae <Nubae!~Nubae136.254.22.95.dynamic.jazztel.es> has joined #dextrose |
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| 01:17 | bernie | Nubae: ah, you're back |
| 01:17 | Nubae: what's the last msg from me you got? | |
| 01:20 | Nubae: do you have connectivity issues? | |
| 01:20 | Nubae: it's 20:20 here... we should really have concluded by now. | |
| 01:21 | Nubae: i'll wait another 2 minutes, then call the end of the meeting (we can continue tomorrow after 6pm EST) | |
| 01:25 | ok | |
| 01:25 | timeout | |
| 01:26 | talk to you again tomorrow (hopefully :) | |
| 01:26 | #endmeeting | |
| 01:26 | meeting | Meeting ended Thu Mar 10 01:26:18 2011 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. (v 0.1.4) |
| 01:26 | Minutes: http://meeting.sugarlabs.org/d[…]-09T23:53:12.html | |
| 01:26 | Log: http://meeting.sugarlabs.org/d[…]11-03-09T23:53:12 | |
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| 03:59 | alsroot | bernie: Re: what's wrong with meeting -- "#topic" is not meeting command, but MeetBot's one, just start you post with such command |
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| 09:11 | Nubae_ | yeah wow... yesterday was incredible... I nwas connecting, disconnecting, constantly... all I got was "Nubae... what was the last thing u heard? Nubae do u have connection..." |
| 09:11 | strange | |
| 09:13 | anyway bernie I'm sure u are asleep right now, let me know when qure qd qround | |
| 09:13 | u r around | |
| 09:13 | menat to type | |
| 09:17 | bernie... lets please not let tnis barbaric flamewar re pxe vs tons of machines being rolled out by CD iso become anything but differing opinions | |
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| 13:24 | tch | m_anish: ping |
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| 16:06 | bernie | nubae: sure, we're all entitled to have our opinions... it doesn't mean we can't work on the same project towards the same goals |
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