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#dextrose, 2011-03-10

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:01 Nubae ok.... as it stands we have varous continents as I see it where people are interested in our server line of product lines, some of which dont exist, others of which are consulting/teaching/lecturing/bug fixing/adding additional specs/deleting crap from platform
00:01 think thats about it
00:03 so far we've had only one of these... a consuting piece asking how to redirect DNS to a different ip (I dont want to use the work dns poisoning)
00:03 ;p
00:04 we should outline our services and products
00:04 just like most companies do
00:04 website is natural to that of course
00:04 bernie sorry, i don't know the background... is this related to the XS or another thing?
00:05 Nubae last week... activites.sugarlabs.org was to be redirected to a local Py server
00:05 in case of outages
00:05 bernie yes?
00:05 Nubae we used DNS masq
00:05 as it allows dnspoisoning... bing does not
00:06 it was a quick fix
00:06 bernie ah ok. let's continue on the customers topic
00:07 Nubae but it worked and will probably set the stage for a more complex caching deamon whereby we can get offline sites to serve slow changing content
00:07 right... I'm saying, that was a server customer
00:07 bernie (no tech details on this topic please, those should come last)
00:08 Nubae agreed, little tech as possible
00:08 so back to website with services and products
00:08 bernie excuse me, who's this customer?
00:08 Nubae Paraguayedyca
00:09 educa sorry
00:09 bernie ah ok
00:10 any other (potential) customer?
00:10 m_anish tch, i'm half awake on this channel :)
00:10 replaceafill <replaceafill!~replaceaf@unaffiliated/replaceafill> has joined #dextrose
00:11 Nubae well, there are ongoing talks with .au but since they are in mid deployment we wont hear much from them for a couple weeks
00:11 bernie m_anish: hello
00:11 Nubae once again though... we need to advertise what services/products are being offered
00:12 bernie Nubae: to recap, at this time we have two potential customers: Paraguay Educa and OLPC.AU. Correct?
00:13 Nubae bernie what is our net so to speak of `potential customers?
00:13 well, those are teh ones I know of... but I'm pretty sure, we could work with Uy too... if we got introduced, understoood their systems, etc
00:13 bernie Nubae: those who are realistically interested in our product at this time. not all the olpc deployments out there.
00:14 Nubae: for example, not uruguay, because they're happy with their own schoolserver so it seems unlikely that they'd switch to ours anytime soon
00:14 Nubae also... anyway using the XS as is (Fedora based) might need help and we could offer our services there too
00:14 bernie (this topic has been going for 15 minutes. better try to find what the needs of these customers are before we switch)
00:15 Nubae well we wouldnt want them to switch, we would want to show them some possible enhancements
00:15 m_anish silently waves to bernie
00:15 Nubae which is why I really want to know a breakdown of their tehcnical strategies
00:15 bernie Nubae: that's too much in the future, let's concentrate on few, very likely customers for now.
00:15 Nubae is is so hard to get that?
00:16 seems to me Uy is next door
00:16 but ok, if u say its closed for the moment, then its closed...
00:16 bernie Nubae: i've been in .uy and spoke to them. my sense is that it's unlikely we'll sell to them for now.
00:17 Nubae iis there at leaszt someone I could emal there to talk to?
00:17 I would not focus on sellling, but on gathering how they've se themselves up
00:17 bernie Nubae: we're not AC's marketing :)
00:18 Nubae: shall we continue with these two customers, Paraguay Educa and OLPC.AU ?
00:18 Nubae i get that, but I cant build a product if I dont know what Uy has?
00:18 it seems silly to alienate everyone, dont u think?
00:19 bernie Nubae: for now, .uy is not our target (unless dfarning tells us so, of course)
00:19 Nubae yes, for now, its just Py, with little to no ideas about what olpc.au would like...
00:20 about as little idea as what Uy is doing
00:20 bernie ok, i was hoping you could tell me more about olpc.au
00:20 Nubae does what I'm saying not make sense?
00:20 replaceafill has quit IRC
00:20 bernie we could ask dfarning if we could have an irc meeting or confcall with the olpc.au guy to discuss their needs
00:21 so we're left with PyEdu. the good news is that i have a very good idea of what their needs are.
00:21 the bad news is that they're not interested in replacing the school servers this year.
00:21 Nubae I can show you their public tracker https://dev.laptop.org.au/projects/xs-au
00:22 bernie (looking at it)
00:22 m_anish bernie, did carlos ping you, re: iptables/rules/setup problems, i was away all day sorting out my visa issues
00:23 bernie Nubae: would you like me to summarize PyEdu's current implementation of XS + XM or do you know it already?
00:23 Nubae thts fine... its going to take is  a while to show a dman kick ass product, which will hopefully turn heads bi natter what previous background
00:23 bernie m_anish: yes, he pinged me yesterday... but i had no time to respond. i dunno if he's done
00:24 Nubae bernie please do
00:24 I kinda feel I'm in the dark
00:24 and working on problems the minute they arise, then making ugly hacks
00:25 bernie ok. PyEdu's offices are in Asuncion, the capital. The office has a low-speed ADSL uplink and a 10mbit VPN going to the deployment site
00:25 in the server room of PyEdu, there's a minitower case labeled "mothership"
00:25 this is the equivalent of our XM
00:26 it lives behind NAT, so it's not publicly accessible by anyone
00:26 this is important for them for security and also because they have only one IP for the whole office
00:26 mothership runs 2-3 things:
00:26 1) a puppet master
00:26 2) the OLPC OATS server
00:27 3) cronjobs to sync content on the schoolservers
00:27 4) (not really) remote backups of all the school servers
00:27 Nubae hmmm
00:27 bernie 4 is not for real because the bandwidth proved to be insufficient for the amount data to backup
00:28 ok, this is the XM side
00:28 in Caacupe, which is 1.5h away from Asuncion, there are 10 old schoolservers + 25 new ones
00:28 the old ones i know well: they were XS 0.6 with plenty of customizations
00:28 Nubae some simple shell scripting could fix bu 4
00:28 bernie the XS are puppet slaves, of course
00:29 Nubae s/bu/bug
00:29 m_anish bernie, ok i'll check
00:29 bernie, thanks!
00:29 bernie if i remember correctly, they try to connect to mothership on a weird port which is forwarded with DNAT by the gateway
00:30 (believe me, i tried to fix 4 with more than simple shell scripting, but i was unsuccessful)
00:30 continuing:
00:30 the schoolservers in Caacupe are desktop computers with some crap mobo and only one HD
00:30 why not RAID1? because the cost was deemed too high
00:31 from time to time, an XS breaks and needs to be serviced
00:31 there are 2 or 3 full-time technicians in Caacupe running around the schools to keep the servers and XOs working
00:31 the XS in the schools are inside a metal cage (anti theft)
00:31 they all have 2 (or 3) ethernet ports:
00:32 1) connected to the wimax radio (which looks like a regular router, we don't care about the details)
00:32 2) connected to the school LAN (which is a stupid switch + a bunch of cheap access points)
00:33 there's a huge mess with bonding and bridged interfaces which is *totally* useless and should not be supported in newer XS releases
00:33 (fyi, it was a crazy idea to support the mesh through "active antennas", which were never produced because access points cost less and work better)
00:34 tch m_anish: feedback and activities both reachable from outside :)
00:34 bernie ok, what do the XSes do in each school?
00:34 m_anish bernie, ^^
00:34 bows to tch
00:34 bernie 1) registration of laptops (using a custom rpm package made by olpc)
00:35 Nubae bernie thats been taken out in ,au
00:35 bernie 2) backups of journals (another custom package)
00:35 Nubae I've already integrated that part into our new kickstart files
00:36 bernie 3) distribution of activation keys (that's complicated, but .py can't leave without this so we must support it if we want to work with them. it will take a lot of time, unfortunately)
00:36 4) collaboration server (the ejabberd crap)
00:36 5) content distribution (they use plone, iirc... not sure if we'd have to support that)
00:37 Nubae ok, interrupting just  a sec with ejabberd
00:37 bernie j0\
00:37 Nubae: no
00:37 Nubae ok, illl wait
00:37 :-)
00:37 bernie Nubae: please let's not talk about ANY solution at  this time
00:37 Nubae: i don't want us to go unfocused and fail to follow the agenda this time
00:38 Nubae it was a questio
00:38 not solution
00:38 bernie Nubae: if it's a question about how ejabberd works now at PyEdu, this is the right time to ask it :)
00:40 Nubae im confused now.... can i ask or not?
00:40 ok, I just will
00:40 how many users per classroom use ejabberd at any one time
00:41 how manu users in the school use ejabberd at any one time
00:42 what kind of collaborative actvities are most being used?
00:42 bernie the biggest schools have 1200 kids
00:42 and i've seen teachers *try* to use collaboration with 20 or so kids
00:42 but a classroom could have 30-40 kids
00:42 Nubae is ejabberd running in loadbalanced manner anywhere?
00:42 bernie no of course not
00:42 they have just one XS per school
00:43 i'm trying to remember if i missed anything important on the XS.
00:43 Nubae 1200 kids and 1 XS?? really?
00:43 bernie ah, yes
00:43 how they're installed!
00:43 they get bought with a bid by the local techies (which are called CATS, btw)
00:44 yes, only one XS
00:44 dogi <dogi!~nemo@c-65-96-166-32.hsd1.ma.comcast.net> has joined #dextrose
00:45 bernie ok, found: the biggest school has 1400 students
00:45 Nubae damn.... ok, next question then is specs
00:45 bernie i have data on all schools
00:45 anyway, let's aim for a scalability of 1000 or so.
00:45 Nubae please please send me
00:45 bernie i could check the specs now but we're running out of time
00:45 we're 45mins into the first topic
00:45 we should switch
00:46 Nubae i wanna see where bottle necks are and see how we can fight them
00:46 bernie ok, this is what the customers currently use
00:46 Nubae they're always fightable
00:46 bernie i have a good sense of what the bottlenecks are
00:46 but let's discuss them another time
00:46 ah, forgot:
00:46 Nubae ok, email again
00:46 bernie 6) web cache (squid)
00:47 7) web filtering (can't remember what... a weird tool)
00:47 Nubae i'll remind at end of meeting
00:47 bernie set action items
00:47 #action bernie send specs of the PyEdu schoolservers to dextrose@
00:47 damn bot
00:48 #stopmeeting
00:48 ok, it just died!
00:48 #startmeeting
00:48 meeting bernie: Error: Can't start another meeting, one is in progress.
00:49 bernie #topic goals
00:49 ok, to cut it short:
00:49 goal #1: meet or exceed all the current features in use at PyEduca
00:50 Nubae bernie squidguard, wwwoffle, bdjdns, dansguardian
00:50 or the visual control center
00:50 bernie to explode the goal into individual items, we should do all the things that i listed above (points 1 to 7) using the same software if possible or better software if we have to
00:52 Nubae: here are the specs:
00:52 Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU     E7400  @ 2.80GHz
00:52 MemTotal:      2065036 kB
00:53 OLPC School Server release 9-0.6
00:53 HD 500GB
00:54 Nubae: i need to take a typing break of 5 mins.
01:03 Nubae: ok, i'm back
01:03 back to the goals topic
01:04 i think matching the capabilities of the current PyEdu setup is a modest goal that we can achieve pretty easily
01:04 we may want to do even better, of course, but we don't have to
01:05 just providing a *supported* XS + XM bundle which works well for one deployment is sufficient for now
01:06 the only change we know we want to do is rebasing everything on a recent version of linux so we can make it work with hw you can buy today
01:06 for this, we seem to have chosen RHEL6
01:06 tch has left #dextrose
01:07 bernie goal #2: rebase all OLPC & PyEdu services on RHEL6
01:07 there's yet another goal: ease of use
01:07 in .py, technicians don't really know linux that well
01:08 it's easy to imagine that it's going to be this way everywhere
01:08 so i'm going to add:
01:09 goal #3: make the installation of XS and XM possible from a single CD, with minimal or no network connectivity, with minimal or no shell interaction
01:09 Nubae has quit IRC
01:09 bernie this is though...
01:09 oops
01:17 Nubae <Nubae!~Nubae@> has joined #dextrose
01:17 bernie Nubae: ah, you're back
01:17 Nubae: what's the last msg from me you got?
01:20 Nubae: do you have connectivity issues?
01:20 Nubae: it's 20:20 here... we should really have concluded by now.
01:21 Nubae: i'll wait another 2 minutes, then call the end of the meeting (we can continue tomorrow after 6pm EST)
01:25 ok
01:25 timeout
01:26 talk to you again tomorrow (hopefully :)
01:26 #endmeeting
01:26 meeting Meeting ended Thu Mar 10 01:26:18 2011 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. (v 0.1.4)
01:26 Minutes: http://meeting.sugarlabs.org/d[…]-09T23:53:12.html
01:26 Log:     http://meeting.sugarlabs.org/d[…]11-03-09T23:53:12
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03:59 alsroot bernie: Re: what's wrong with meeting -- "#topic" is not meeting command, but MeetBot's one, just start you post with such command
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09:11 Nubae_ yeah wow... yesterday was incredible... I nwas connecting, disconnecting, constantly... all I got was "Nubae... what was the last thing u heard? Nubae do u have connection..."
09:11 strange
09:13 anyway bernie I'm sure u are asleep right now, let me know when qure qd qround
09:13 u r around
09:13 menat to type
09:17 bernie... lets please not let tnis barbaric flamewar re pxe vs tons of machines being rolled out by CD iso become anything but differing opinions
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13:24 tch m_anish: ping
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16:06 bernie nubae: sure, we're all entitled to have our opinions... it doesn't mean we can't work on the same project towards the same goals
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